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 Post subject: Re: The Onside Kick
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2018 11:50 pm 
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swissvale72 wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
955876 wrote:
And that punt would have pinned us deep. Giving us further to go on what was already going to be limited time.

10-15 yards of FP probably. That's not much.

A punt from just inside the 40, probably you get it at the 10 or 15. A punt from their 34 you fair catch around the 20 or 25.

I thought the call was 50/50 at the time, although the computer models say the onside was a whisker better chance. Neither option had better than a 4% chance of becoming a win.


You're underestimating....see other OP. More like 25 yards dif in FP....and Steelers needing a TD to tie.

Minimizing the difference in yardage needed is akin to Tomlin throwing away precious seconds before calling timeout.



25 yards is worse case scenario, best case scenario is about 5-10 yards diff. I would take a chance to get the ball on an onside versus having to go an extra 25 yards with almost 2 minutes left anyday. Two minutes in the NFL is an eternity, hell we saw the Steelers go damn near 80 yards in less than 30 seconds against the Pats a few weeks ago.


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 Post subject: Re: The Onside Kick
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2018 11:58 pm 
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GreekSteel wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
955876 wrote:
And that punt would have pinned us deep. Giving us further to go on what was already going to be limited time.

10-15 yards of FP probably. That's not much.

A punt from just inside the 40, probably you get it at the 10 or 15. A punt from their 34 you fair catch around the 20 or 25.

I thought the call was 50/50 at the time, although the computer models say the onside was a whisker better chance. Neither option had better than a 4% chance of becoming a win.



Sorry but i call BS

Quote:
One other thing that I thought deserved some discussion was Pittsburgh's onside kick down 42-35 with a two-minute warning and two timeouts left. GWC agreed with the decision by a very small margin, favoring the onside kick 4.2 percent to 3.8 percent for the kickoff. Certainly the circumstances of Pittsburgh's defense getting their ass kicked helped as well. I get it, but it's so hard to come back from 10 points down at that point in time I probably would've kicked it off regularly and hoped for the best.


footballoutsiders.com

https://twitter.com/edjsports

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 Post subject: Re: The Onside Kick
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 11:55 am 
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StillerDownSouth wrote:
What are you talking about Gonzo, there was 1 second on the clock on final kick off, clock starts once ball is touched and had we recovered we could’t advance it. Only way PS could have scored was if they kicked it and the ball somehow made it to the endzone with us recovering it.

Exactly...the only option at that point.

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 Post subject: Re: The Onside Kick
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:15 pm 
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While you guys are arguing about onside kick or not, I want to know why the two times Boswell tried it he flubbed it bad.

As a kicker you have a handful of techniques at your disposal, and he failed miserably two consecutive times. Failing an onside kick shouldn't be determined by the kicker fucking up. AND it's not like they surprised Jax with the kick. There was no play design other than try to kick it ten yards and hope for the best. All five guys on that side of the field just went north.

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 Post subject: Re: The Onside Kick
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:23 pm 
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COR-TEN wrote:
While you guys are arguing about onside kick or not, I want to know why the two times Boswell tried it he flubbed it bad.

As a kicker you have a handful of techniques at your disposal, and he failed miserably two consecutive times. Failing an onside kick shouldn't be determined by the kicker fucking up. AND it's not like they surprised Jax with the kick. There was no play design other than try to kick it ten yards and hope for the best. All five guys on that side of the field just went north.


I’ve seen a lot of bad onside kicks over the years, and that one was up there with the very very worst. Zero play design and apparent confusion on the field and on the sidelines as to what they were going to try. Am I wrong in remembering another one where Boswell went for the ball and barely touched it sending it a few inches forward? I absolutely love Boswell as a kicker. Brilliant. It’s hard to be an mvp candidate on a team with this much offensive talent, but he practically qualified. But, please, let’s learn a few variations on an emergency play, and give him some sense of technique.


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 Post subject: Re: The Onside Kick
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:29 pm 
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Will-the-Shake wrote:
COR-TEN wrote:
While you guys are arguing about onside kick or not, I want to know why the two times Boswell tried it he flubbed it bad.

As a kicker you have a handful of techniques at your disposal, and he failed miserably two consecutive times. Failing an onside kick shouldn't be determined by the kicker fucking up. AND it's not like they surprised Jax with the kick. There was no play design other than try to kick it ten yards and hope for the best. All five guys on that side of the field just went north.


I’ve seen a lot of bad onside kicks over the years, and that one was up there with the very very worst. Zero play design and apparent confusion on the field and on the sidelines as to what they were going to try. Am I wrong in remembering another one where Boswell went for the ball and barely touched it sending it a few inches forward? I absolutely love Boswell as a kicker. Brilliant. It’s hard to be an mvp candidate on a team with this much offensive talent, but he practically qualified. But, please, let’s learn a few variations on an emergency play, and give him some sense of technique.




That was when he tried a soccer trick kick called the Rabona.


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 Post subject: Re: The Onside Kick
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:37 pm 
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GreekSteel wrote:
Will-the-Shake wrote:
COR-TEN wrote:
While you guys are arguing about onside kick or not, I want to know why the two times Boswell tried it he flubbed it bad.

As a kicker you have a handful of techniques at your disposal, and he failed miserably two consecutive times. Failing an onside kick shouldn't be determined by the kicker fucking up. AND it's not like they surprised Jax with the kick. There was no play design other than try to kick it ten yards and hope for the best. All five guys on that side of the field just went north.


I’ve seen a lot of bad onside kicks over the years, and that one was up there with the very very worst. Zero play design and apparent confusion on the field and on the sidelines as to what they were going to try. Am I wrong in remembering another one where Boswell went for the ball and barely touched it sending it a few inches forward? I absolutely love Boswell as a kicker. Brilliant. It’s hard to be an mvp candidate on a team with this much offensive talent, but he practically qualified. But, please, let’s learn a few variations on an emergency play, and give him some sense of technique.




That was when he tried a soccer trick kick called the Rabona.


Right! I remember it clearly now. Terrible execution of the rabona, and in the wrong sport to boot.


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 Post subject: Re: The Onside Kick
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:42 pm 
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Will-the-Shake wrote:
COR-TEN wrote:
While you guys are arguing about onside kick or not, I want to know why the two times Boswell tried it he flubbed it bad.

As a kicker you have a handful of techniques at your disposal, and he failed miserably two consecutive times. Failing an onside kick shouldn't be determined by the kicker fucking up. AND it's not like they surprised Jax with the kick. There was no play design other than try to kick it ten yards and hope for the best. All five guys on that side of the field just went north.


I’ve seen a lot of bad onside kicks over the years, and that one was up there with the very very worst. Zero play design and apparent confusion on the field and on the sidelines as to what they were going to try. Am I wrong in remembering another one where Boswell went for the ball and barely touched it sending it a few inches forward? I absolutely love Boswell as a kicker. Brilliant. It’s hard to be an mvp candidate on a team with this much offensive talent, but he practically qualified. But, please, let’s learn a few variations on an emergency play, and give him some sense of technique.
You'd think considering the number of games they won by three points going down to the wire, they'd have number of onside kick formations, and would have practiced them more than usual - as it might be needed in close games. They looked like the keystone cops. Just like the last series after the overturned James TD against the pats.

Just like a corporation might hire an efficiency expert or expediter, the steelers need a disciplinarian that has the team prepared and ready to go in an instant. Haley didn't do it with the offense, Butler isn't doing it with the defense, and Smith is an enigma, increasing punt and FG kick blocks, maybe a fake punt, but fails miserably with ST penalties, punt and kick returns and coverage.

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 Post subject: Re: The Onside Kick
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:48 pm 
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As most of the arguments involve statistical analysis of probabilities, consider this: Jacksonville was 100% successful in NEVER going 3 and out.


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 Post subject: Re: The Onside Kick
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:58 pm 
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XPGH wrote:
As most of the arguments involve statistical analysis of probabilities, consider this: Jacksonville was 100% successful in NEVER going 3 and out.


Except on their last drive after the onsides kick when they ran 3 straight obvious running plays that the defense knew were coming and stopped them.


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