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 Post subject: Re: This is Tomlin's defense. What else do you need to know?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 9:59 pm 
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Kodiak wrote:
This team, and defense, largely feasted on bad teams led by back-up or shit QB's. They were a paper tiger all year, carried purely by Bell, AB and Ben for the most part.

Butler said in an article back in Aug(?) that Tomlin has a lot of input on both sides of the ball and is very involved.

EMR won't fire Butler because Butler passed up jobs waiting for Lebeau to leave, and EMR won't pull the rug out after just a few years.

Looking forward to 9-10 wins next year and, if we're lucky, maybe another playoff game.


Good post. In retrospect, I think we were all in denial about how bad this defense was. The second Browns game should have set off alarm bells, but I think we all probably wrote it off as a game the Steelers didn't care about and therefore weren't trying that hard (which is concerning in its own right).

One other thing- I didn't realize until today that Butler and Tomlin coached together before the Steelers- in 1998 at Arkansas State. Butler was on the Steelers' staff for several years before Tomlin was hired. I wonder whether Butler helped Tomlin get an interview during the coaching search. If so, I'd bet Tomlin feels a great amount of loyalty and gratitude towards Butler. No wonder he's hesitant to fire his friend.


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 Post subject: Re: This is Tomlin's defense. What else do you need to know?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:04 pm 
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Last 5 1st round picks and 3 of the last 5 2nd round picks have gone to the defensive side of the ball, let that sink in for a moment,,,8 of the last top 10 draft picks have been used on the defense, and these guys cant stop a nosebleed against BB and the fkn Jags or the bears, or rickey fuckin hundley or deshone kizer... Tomlin Butler and his coaching hires are all fucking clueless at how to develop defensive players or get the best out of them.


Last edited by GreekSteel on Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: This is Tomlin's defense. What else do you need to know?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:06 pm 
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fortythree wrote:
The #1 issue with the defense in that game is that Sean Spence fucking sucks and they couldn't or wouldn't take him off the field for anybody else.


Is that the #1 issue? Perhaps. But let's not pretend that Bud Dupree doesn't suck. That Bince Williams isn't a liability all too often. That Jason Hargrave took a step back and got his ass absolutely shellacked at times this year. That neither Sean Davis nor Artie Burns is anything to write home about. But I'm sure all that will work itself out once Tomlin puts his finishing touches on everything.

Let's also not forget that Tomlin was apparently perfectly OK with the paper fucking thin depth at linebacker going into this season. What happened to Shazier was horrific- but let's not act as if it was completely unforeseeable that he would miss time in 2017 at some juncture.


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 Post subject: Re: This is Tomlin's defense. What else do you need to know?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:11 pm 
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GreekSteel wrote:
Last 5 1st round picks and 3 of the last 5 2nd round picks have gone to the defensive side of the ball, let that sink in for a moment,,,8 of the last top 10 draft picks have been used on the defense, and these guys cant stop a nosebleed against BB and the fkn Jags or the bears, or rickey fuckin hundley or deshone kizer... Tomlin Butler and his coaching hires are all fucking clueless at how to develop players or get the best out of them.


Well at least Tomlin and co will get another crack at it this draft.

“C’mon...no whammies, no whammies, no whammies.... pick!”


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 Post subject: Re: This is Tomlin's defense. What else do you need to know?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:46 pm 
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Tomlin defense well it's interesting but someone needs to go


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 Post subject: Re: This is Tomlin's defense. What else do you need to know?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:54 pm 
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Man, signing Navarro Bowman or a quality veteran ILB would’ve been sweet action. It’s not like Colbert didn’t know the position needed bolstering since they offered Dont’a Hightower a free agent deal but you have to give Colbert and even Tomlin credit for jumping on joe Haden and trading for fragile Vance McDonald. Out of character aggressive late moves to bolster weak spots on the roster. Yes Shazier has a history of missing games but nobody could foresee the on field tragedy that took place so I can’t completely fault the gamble on shazier staying healthy given the effort to patch holes in other areas.

Nope, I can’t blame the lack of inside linebacker depth. My angst falls squarely on the defensive coaching staff. Embarrassingly terrible against Brady in the title game and even worse against bortles...WITH two whole weeks to prepare. Zero player development by any coach on the defensive side of the ball. So frustrating.Guess I’m still flabbergasted that not a single coach was let go on the defensive side of the ball.

So many issues with this team. Why ESPN wrote about a little rift in the Patriots organization and not the chaos that was the 2018 Pittsburgh Steelers is beyond me.


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 Post subject: Re: This is Tomlin's defense. What else do you need to know?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 11:08 pm 
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redmanrumbles wrote:
Tell me a young player that looked better this year. I think Hargrave and Burns definitely regressed. At best Sean Davis remained the same. And I dare anyone to take the time to actually just rewatch some games and focus on Bud Dupree. The guy is horrible. He has no push and all too often gets collapsed in the run game. And while Watt flashed at times he is by no means a guarantee either(at least not with the coaches around to groom him)

And I'm sorry. I love Cam Heyward. But for the money invested in him and Tuitt they just aren't destructive enough. Was Tuitt hurt all year. Because he was JUST A GUY way too much down the stretch. If Tomlin is in fact intent on making this his personal project I don't see how the hell we get better to the degree we need to get better. You need a lot of help on that defense. Even leaving the defensive line alone(which you really shouldn't because Hargrave is a major liablity in the run game) you need 2 inside backers("Bince" isn't a starter) you need a free safety and you really need to get an outside backer. Is Dupree's light finally going to come on next year.


Dupree spent more time on his back and on the ground more than a Bangkok whore. Sometimes his feet gets tangled, sometimes he can't disengage from blockers (OL, TE, RB, grandma in a moo moo) and sometimes it's both. Looks like he's still out there thinking about what to do instead of just doing it. He has no pass rush moves except to get to outside edge and then titty fight. For all of his vaunted coaching w/ Chuck Smith on pass rushing, he failed miserably. Maybe it's the scheme or maybe it's him or a combo of both but he is weak and horrible at the position.

I really believe Tuitt was still injured and he never recovered fully from the bicep injury and he came back too soon as he was a shell of his former self and that began to wear down on Heyward who felt he had to pick up the slack. From what I saw on those later games in the season the team went back to a more of a read/react, gap control play along the D-line instead of the quick penetration play that we were seeing earlier. Maybe they were doing that to try and protect the Spences and Forts of the world by keeping blockers off of them but as we all can see it wasn't working..


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 Post subject: Re: This is Tomlin's defense. What else do you need to know?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 11:10 pm 
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the-other-burg wrote:
GreekSteel wrote:
Last 5 1st round picks and 3 of the last 5 2nd round picks have gone to the defensive side of the ball, let that sink in for a moment,,,8 of the last top 10 draft picks have been used on the defense, and these guys cant stop a nosebleed against BB and the fkn Jags or the bears, or rickey fuckin hundley or deshone kizer... Tomlin Butler and his coaching hires are all fucking clueless at how to develop players or get the best out of them.


Well at least Tomlin and co will get another crack at it this draft.

“C’mon...no whammies, no whammies, no whammies.... pick!”


I would love us to get the ILB outta Georgia. He's a beast.


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 Post subject: Re: This is Tomlin's defense. What else do you need to know?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 11:10 pm 
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SteelDrama wrote:
Man, signing Navarro Bowman or a quality veteran ILB would’ve been sweet action. It’s not like Colbert didn’t know the position needed bolstering since they offered Dont’a Hightower a free agent deal but you have to give Colbert and even Tomlin credit for jumping on joe Haden and trading for fragile Vance McDonald. Out of character aggressive late moves to bolster weak spots on the roster. Yes Shazier has a history of missing games but nobody could foresee the on field tragedy that took place so I can’t completely fault the gamble on shazier staying healthy given the effort to patch holes in other areas.

Nope, I can’t blame the lack of inside linebacker depth. My angst falls squarely on the defensive coaching staff. Embarrassingly terrible against Brady in the title game and even worse against bortles...WITH two whole weeks to prepare. Zero player development by any coach on the defensive side of the ball. So frustrating.Guess I’m still flabbergasted that not a single coach was let go on the defensive side of the ball.

So many issues with this team. Why ESPN wrote about a little rift in the Patriots organization and not the chaos that was the 2018 Pittsburgh Steelers is beyond me.

I can see people are starting to group the last two playoff losses, but I don't think they're the same. I think there was a noticeable upgrade in defensive talent between last year and this year. For last year's AFCCG, I just don't think we had the horses to stop the Pats. Last offseason, they made noticeable attempts to bring in better cover guys and bring in better pass rushers. I'm much more concerned about this year's playoff loss than last year's.


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 Post subject: Re: This is Tomlin's defense. What else do you need to know?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 11:13 pm 
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fortythree wrote:
The #1 issue with the defense in that game is that Sean Spence fucking sucks and they couldn't or wouldn't take him off the field for anybody else.

I realize this is real life and not Madden, but when Shaz went down, I couldn't help but think about them going to a 4-3. It seemed to make sense since we had more Dlinemen than linebackers at that point. Now these are not Madden characters, they are real human beings. Would it have been too difficult to install a 4-3 D mid-season like that?


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