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 Post subject: Re: Jesse James was more of a TD than Ertz
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 11:27 pm 
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fortythree wrote:
Zeke5123 wrote:
TB wrote:
:lol: No.

Ertz took three steps before he was even contacted, then lunged and crossed the plane. James took 0 steps, was falling as he caught it. Not that hard to see the clear difference.


I do agree the Ertz call was easy. If they overturned that, then well that's absurd.

But James went to a knee and made a COD move. By letter of rule, it was a catch.


No. It wasn't.


I've explained it numerous times. I've posted the language of the rule. All you have done is say "Nope." Care to post the rule and explain how it wasn't a catch? I know you won't but Ill be waiting.


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 Post subject: Re: Jesse James Catch was a TD as was Ertz Catch
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 11:27 pm 
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ChippedHamSandwich wrote:
You guys seem to have all the answers when it comes to this.

You should apply with the NFL offices tomorrow morning, they could use some brainiacs.

Those two plays are incredibly similar, James even brought the ball into his chest before he extended.


No. James on his knees twisting to EZ. Iggles dude took like three steps.

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 Post subject: Re: Jesse James was more of a TD than Ertz
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 11:27 pm 
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fortythree wrote:
Zeke5123 wrote:
TB wrote:
:lol: No.

Ertz took three steps before he was even contacted, then lunged and crossed the plane. James took 0 steps, was falling as he caught it. Not that hard to see the clear difference.


I do agree the Ertz call was easy. If they overturned that, then well that's absurd.

But James went to a knee and made a COD move. By letter of rule, it was a catch.


No. It wasn't.


Not at all. James was going down as he made the catch, which is exactly the case the rule was written for.

Ertz was freely running after the catch.


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 Post subject: Re: Jesse James Catch was a TD as was Ertz Catch
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 11:28 pm 
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You can argue that James made a football move...there is no doubt that Ertz made a football move...

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 Post subject: Re: Jesse James Catch was a TD as was Ertz Catch
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 11:30 pm 
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Jobus Rum wrote:
You can argue that James made a football move...there is no doubt that Ertz made a football move...


This is of course correct. I wouldn't say argue w/r/t James' catch (I think it is close), but impossible to say it was conclusive (which is what was needed).


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 Post subject: Re: Jesse James was more of a TD than Ertz
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 11:34 pm 
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Louis Lipps Service wrote:

Not at all. James was going down as he made the catch, which is exactly the case the rule was written for.

Ertz was freely running after the catch.

Yes. As dumb as the rule is James was not a runner and did not survive the ground as a catch. Ertz was a runner plain and simple.


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 Post subject: Re: Jesse James was more of a TD than Ertz
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 11:35 pm 
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Still Lit wrote:
Jeemie wrote:
Ertz took three steps.

James didn’t.

They haven’t counted what James did as a football move since the rule was changed.


Yeah, this thread is beyond absurd.


Well, FWIW, I believe they SHOULD count what James did as a catch.

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 Post subject: Re: Jesse James Catch was a TD as was Ertz Catch
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 11:37 pm 
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From page 31 of the official NFL rulebook:

Quote:
Item 1. Player Going to the Ground. A player is considered to be going to the ground if he does not remain upright long
enough to demonstrate that he is clearly a runner. If a player goes to the ground in the act of catching a pass (with or without
contact by an opponent), he must maintain control of the ball until after his initial contact with the ground, whether in the field of
play or the end zone. If he loses control of the ball, and the ball touches the ground before he regains control, the pass is
incomplete. If he regains control prior to the ball touching the ground, the pass is complete.


James didn't stay upright enough to demonstrate he was a runner, was considered a "player going to the ground," lost control of the ball with it touching the ground before he regained control.

By rule, it was incomplete.

Now, whether the rule should be changed is a completely different argument.


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 Post subject: Re: Jesse James Catch was a TD as was Ertz Catch
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 11:38 pm 
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Rule was written for when a player catches ball while going to ground. James went to ground, then turned. James should've been a catch. Nfl realized their errors and started changing the way they call it. It's been called differently since James. So, way I see it, steelers should get half a sb tnite.


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 Post subject: Re: Jesse James was more of a TD than Ertz
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 11:40 pm 
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Jackie Chiles wrote:
Louis Lipps Service wrote:

Not at all. James was going down as he made the catch, which is exactly the case the rule was written for.

Ertz was freely running after the catch.

Yes. As dumb as the rule is James was not a runner and did not survive the ground as a catch. Ertz was a runner plain and simple.


Once again, far from clear that he was not a runner. The rule for becoming a runner is:

Quote:
A player has the ball long enough to become a runner when, after his second foot is on the ground, he is capable of avoiding or warding off impending contact of an opponent, tucking the ball away, turning up field, or taking additional steps


He both tucked and turned up field. Therefore, James completed this part of this catch rule.

The only thing added by going to the ground is, that in addition to the above, the receiver going to the ground

Quote:
... must maintain control of the ball until after his initial contact with the ground, whether in the field of play or the end zone. If he loses control of the ball, and the ball touches the ground before he regains control, the pass is incomplete. If he regains control prior to the ball touching the ground, the pass is complete.



The initial contact was James' knee. James then pushed off that knee as he tried to go into the EZ. Thus, James survived initial contact.

Remember -- the replay booth must determine that James either did not (i) tuck it or turn up field OR (ii) not maintain control of the ball after his initial contact with the ground BASED ON IRREFUTABLE EVIDENCE. I don't see how that was satisfied in the James' catch.


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