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 Post subject: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jealous
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:27 am 
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I don't understand with all the good coaching prospects that we have to be stuck with the same old, same old. The football genius, Bill Belichik didn't seem so brilliant up against Peterson. I like what one of the commentators mentioned about the Eagles coaching staff going to Foles at the end of the season & asking him which plays he was most comfortable & working with them.
I can appreciate the Rooney's point of view to keep a head coach forever but the times have changed & the other partners should try to mount a coup. No one is guaranteed a job forever ever & the world has changed, If the Steelers don't join the modern times, our glory will just be the past.


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:40 am 
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http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... to-go-8-8/

We're doomed.

:lol:

Quote:
Eagles coach Doug Pederson was the most aggressive coach on fourth downs all season, and that didn’t change in the Super Bowl. Pederson says there’s a simple reason for that: It’s the way to win.

Pederson told Peter King after the game that if you want to play it safe all the time, that’s a great way to be at or near .500 all the time. If you want to win a championship, you need to try some high-risk, high-reward plays.

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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:52 am 
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With the Steelers lack of excellent or even good coaching, we have depended on Big Ben & 84 to make us look like a better team. As has been shown by FC & others, our scouting/drafting needs a make-over, too but without a new GM & HC, the same old, same old continues. I don't really get it - looking from a distance (Toronto), Pittsburgh seems like a modern, fresh-thinking city but the Steelers seem lost in time.


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:01 am 
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blu wrote:
With the Steelers lack of excellent or even good coaching, we have depended on Big Ben & 84 to make us look like a better team. As has been shown by FC & others, our scouting/drafting needs a make-over, too but without a new GM & HC, the same old, same old continues. I don't really get it - looking from a distance (Toronto), Pittsburgh seems like a modern, fresh-thinking city but the Steelers seem lost in time.


I will disagree about the GM. Comparing what Colbert has done with a Franchise QB under contract since 2008 to the Eagles or the Jaguars is wrong. Almost any idiot can run a team when they are not constrained by the cap. Without the franchise QB taking up 1/4 to 1/3 of the cap space a GM can have draft failures that are made up by FA. That Colbert and co. have kept the Steelers competitive for so long is a testament to hitting on drafts more than missing.

The draft is always a crap shoot. There is no one way to draft for success.

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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:03 am 
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Blu...

I felt the same way. The Steelers would have punted late in the 4th. The Steelers would have kicked the FG on 4th down etc. etc etc.

That was coaching to win, and it was fun to watch.


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:04 am 
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Two quotes from the SI pieces this morning.

“Playing quarterback, watching a lot of teams, a lot of football,” he said. “You learn if you play passive, if you play conservative, if you call plays conservatively, you are going to be 8-8, 9-7 every year. Every year. Frank and I just having that collaborative spirit to talk about things and talk with our quarterbacks and just come up with ways of keeping this game fresh and fun and exciting for our players. And that's really where it all stems from.”

Without a talent like Ben you go 8-8 9-7. With him you go 11-5, 12-4 and bow out of the playoffs early.

Pederson and Reich called a great game. Great scheme.

“We knew they had problems when you force them to defend stacks and bunches,” said one Eagles offensive assistant after the game. “You look at early in the year, against those stacks, they were losing guys.”

What the Eagles saw, particularly in that Carolina game, was that the Patriots couldn’t figure out how to defend receivers who released together on intersected routes, especially when pre-snap motion was involved.

Paging the golfer. Will Fichtner notice this shit. We'll see


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:06 am 
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Charles Demarr wrote:
Blu...

I felt the same way. The Steelers would have punted late in the 4th. The Steelers would have kicked the FG on 4th down etc. etc etc.

That was coaching to win, and it was fun to watch.




yup...the game that Pederson called was the "anti Tomlin game"...very prepared team....aggressive but smart play calling


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:20 am 
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GreekSteel wrote:
Charles Demarr wrote:
Blu...

I felt the same way. The Steelers would have punted late in the 4th. The Steelers would have kicked the FG on 4th down etc. etc etc.

That was coaching to win, and it was fun to watch.




yup...the game that Pederson called was the "anti Tomlin game"...very prepared team....aggressive but smart play calling

That reminds me of the year conservative Cowher made it through the playoffs & won the big game as Cowher for that stretch was the Bizzaro, anti-Cowher. I was hoping that Tomlin would do that in the post-season this year but I don't think Tomlin can go there.


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:34 am 
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blu wrote:
GreekSteel wrote:
Charles Demarr wrote:
Blu...

I felt the same way. The Steelers would have punted late in the 4th. The Steelers would have kicked the FG on 4th down etc. etc etc.

That was coaching to win, and it was fun to watch.




yup...the game that Pederson called was the "anti Tomlin game"...very prepared team....aggressive but smart play calling

That reminds me of the year conservative Cowher made it through the playoffs & won the big game as Cowher for that stretch was the Bizzaro, anti-Cowher. I was hoping that Tomlin would do that in the post-season this year but I don't think Tomlin can go there.




agreed


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:46 am 
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blu wrote:
GreekSteel wrote:
Charles Demarr wrote:
Blu...

I felt the same way. The Steelers would have punted late in the 4th. The Steelers would have kicked the FG on 4th down etc. etc etc.

That was coaching to win, and it was fun to watch.




yup...the game that Pederson called was the "anti Tomlin game"...very prepared team....aggressive but smart play calling

That reminds me of the year conservative Cowher made it through the playoffs & won the big game as Cowher for that stretch was the Bizzaro, anti-Cowher. I was hoping that Tomlin would do that in the post-season this year but I don't think Tomlin can go there.


He can go there.

But it only seems he can go there when pressed to do it...i.e. when the team is losing and needs a spark.

Otherwise, it's conservative city....like H2 of the New England game.

Pederson did some other anti-Tomlin things. I especially liked how he would often run the ball on passing downs and distances.

Only mistake I saw him make strategy/tactics-wise was fail to take his shot to salt the game and pass on second down with 2:03 left.

Other than that, it was a flawless game. Went for it on fourth down when he had to...was smart aggressive as opposed to how Dan Quinn was dumb aggressive last year, and Pete Carroll two years before that.

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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:51 am 
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Baltostiller wrote:
Two quotes from the SI pieces this morning.

“Playing quarterback, watching a lot of teams, a lot of football,” he said. “You learn if you play passive, if you play conservative, if you call plays conservatively, you are going to be 8-8, 9-7 every year. Every year. Frank and I just having that collaborative spirit to talk about things and talk with our quarterbacks and just come up with ways of keeping this game fresh and fun and exciting for our players. And that's really where it all stems from.”

Without a talent like Ben you go 8-8 9-7. With him you go 11-5, 12-4 and bow out of the playoffs early.

Pederson and Reich called a great game. Great scheme.

“We knew they had problems when you force them to defend stacks and bunches,” said one Eagles offensive assistant after the game. “You look at early in the year, against those stacks, they were losing guys.”

What the Eagles saw, particularly in that Carolina game, was that the Patriots couldn’t figure out how to defend receivers who released together on intersected routes, especially when pre-snap motion was involved.

Paging the golfer. Will Fichtner notice this shit. We'll see


The other problem with Mike Tomlin, potentially, because I have no way of knowing if this is true.

He has many times said he doesn't really watch other games. I don't know if this includes the Super Bowl.

So I wonder if he watched last night so there's at least the possibility that he has learned from it.

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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:53 am 
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good way to never have a losing record ....
content


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 12:10 pm 
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Jeemie wrote:
The other problem with Mike Tomlin, potentially, because I have no way of knowing if this is true.

He has many times said he doesn't really watch other games. I don't know if this includes the Super Bowl.

So I wonder if he watched last night so there's at least the possibility that he has learned from it.


This can't be true.

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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 12:26 pm 
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Another quote from TFF Peter King's piece today.

"Reich told me the kernel of the idea originated from an industrious Eagles quality-control coach, Press Taylor. Said Reich: “Press has this, what we call this vault of trick plays. It's an immense vault, so every week we go into Press's vault looking for plays.” Taylor, it appears, found the play in a meaningless Week 17 game in 2016."

Did Tomlin/Haley/Fichtner have a guy doing this. My college roommate was the Offensive Quality Control coach for the Ravens under Marchibroda. It is a thankless job where they grind you 80-100 hours a week looking at film, studying tendencies, finding plays, etc.

I don't see anything that the Steelers have done on offense in the past several years that would indicate that they put a premium on this type of thinking.


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 12:43 pm 
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Whatever your thoughts are on Tomlin it still is time for a change... This team has become stale and predictable.

I don't believe they will make a change and we are stuck with Tomlin until he chooses to call it quits.


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 12:44 pm 
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The bottom line is they played balls out to win, they risked losing points and field position and played gutsy. They bucked the 50 year old trend of playing the %.


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 12:47 pm 
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Charles Demarr wrote:
Blu...

I felt the same way. The Steelers would have punted late in the 4th. The Steelers would have kicked the FG on 4th down etc. etc etc.

That was coaching to win, and it was fun to watch.


THIS^^^ Is exactly what I'm talking about, they played to beat the Patriots, not to avoid mistakes, they risked making huge mistakes, that's why they won.


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 12:48 pm 
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Baltostiller wrote:
Another quote from TFF Peter King's piece today.

"Reich told me the kernel of the idea originated from an industrious Eagles quality-control coach, Press Taylor. Said Reich: “Press has this, what we call this vault of trick plays. It's an immense vault, so every week we go into Press's vault looking for plays.” Taylor, it appears, found the play in a meaningless Week 17 game in 2016."

Did Tomlin/Haley/Fichtner have a guy doing this. My college roommate was the Offensive Quality Control coach for the Ravens under Marchibroda. It is a thankless job where they grind you 80-100 hours a week looking at film, studying tendencies, finding plays, etc.

I don't see anything that the Steelers have done on offense in the past several years that would indicate that they put a premium on this type of thinking.

This is exactly how the Pats have been playing chess while Tomlin (along with most of the league) has been playing checkers all these years. Brady was interviewed last week and stated just that. They have a massive vault of video from almost two decades of games that they pull up every Monday and install it that week to beat the tendencies of their next opponent (read..do what we do..here). All the players have to do is watch the video to understand what that weeks assignment/gameplan is. They pick all types of plays, from all types of games, from many different years. I assume Ernie Adams is the straw that stirs that video drink. It's how they can plug in just about any player and be pretty successful. It truly is playing chess against checkers, even when your chess players are much lesser athletes, which is often the case with Pats players overall.

When will Tomlin and the PS learn? There are people out there that can do this, Tomlin et al just have to be willing and smart enough (that's the big question) to implement it.


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 12:50 pm 
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The Steelers have both an analytics guy for past few years AND I believe it's the young Rooney who does the old video compilations.

Now, NE undoubtedly has it down to a science but I think the Steelers of the past couple of years are at least trying to get into the 21st century. They have a LOT of old dogs in that scouting department, though.

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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 12:58 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
The Steelers have both an analytics guy for past few years AND I believe it's the young Rooney who does the old video compilations.

Now, NE undoubtedly has it down to a science but I think the Steelers of the past couple of years are at least trying to get into the 21st century. They have a LOT of old dogs in that scouting department, though.

That's all well and good. And, I don't expect them to be perfect at it in a very short period of time, but the problem I have is when your head coach has that info at his deposal but throws it all out the window and let his 'gut' take over come situational football time. Unless you're an X's & O's/game clock manager whisperer (which he's not), it's stupid, just plain stupid (and arrogant).


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 1:14 pm 
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why is everyone dumping on the Potted Plant again? Heck, he's the King of the Two Point conversion attempt...That shows real risk taking...


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 1:16 pm 
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Baltostiller wrote:
Another quote from TFF Peter King's piece today.

"Reich told me the kernel of the idea originated from an industrious Eagles quality-control coach, Press Taylor. Said Reich: “Press has this, what we call this vault of trick plays. It's an immense vault, so every week we go into Press's vault looking for plays.” Taylor, it appears, found the play in a meaningless Week 17 game in 2016."

Did Tomlin/Haley/Fichtner have a guy doing this. My college roommate was the Offensive Quality Control coach for the Ravens under Marchibroda. It is a thankless job where they grind you 80-100 hours a week looking at film, studying tendencies, finding plays, etc.

I don't see anything that the Steelers have done on offense in the past several years that would indicate that they put a premium on this type of thinking.


The key to this play is not just to have it, but to practice it. On this particular play, everything had to be handled just right, or the Eagles would have been whistled for a procedure penalty.

Foles had to be in shotgun, not under center. He then had to set himself before the ball was snapped to Clement.

Then, for the play to work, Foles had to sit still for a tick before leaking out into the pattern so the defense would be drawn to where Clement was running with the ball.

They worked the play to (near) perfection...only miniscule error was that Alshon Jeffrey was just a hair off the LOS and they could have been flagged for a formation penalty (it was close enough that a no call was the correct thing, but Jeffrey was off the line just enough that some Pats' fans are whining about it today).

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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 1:20 pm 
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Jeemie wrote:
Baltostiller wrote:
Another quote from TFF Peter King's piece today.

"Reich told me the kernel of the idea originated from an industrious Eagles quality-control coach, Press Taylor. Said Reich: “Press has this, what we call this vault of trick plays. It's an immense vault, so every week we go into Press's vault looking for plays.” Taylor, it appears, found the play in a meaningless Week 17 game in 2016."

Did Tomlin/Haley/Fichtner have a guy doing this. My college roommate was the Offensive Quality Control coach for the Ravens under Marchibroda. It is a thankless job where they grind you 80-100 hours a week looking at film, studying tendencies, finding plays, etc.

I don't see anything that the Steelers have done on offense in the past several years that would indicate that they put a premium on this type of thinking.


The key to this play is not just to have it, but to practice it. On this particular play, everything had to be handled just right, or the Eagles would have been whistled for a procedure penalty.

Foles had to be in shotgun, not under center. He then had to set himself before the ball was snapped to Clement.

Then, for the play to work, Foles had to sit still for a tick before leaking out into the pattern so the defense would be drawn to where Clement was running with the ball.

They worked the play to (near) perfection...only miniscule error was that Alshon Jeffrey was just a hair off the LOS and they could have been flagged for a formation penalty (it was close enough that a no call was the correct thing, but Jeffrey was off the line just enough that some Pats' fans are whining about it today).


As someone said on another thread, Jeffrey looks to the line judge (I think) and confirms that he is considered "on the line" thus no penalty. STFU Pats* fans.


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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 1:52 pm 
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DP39 wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
The Steelers have both an analytics guy for past few years AND I believe it's the young Rooney who does the old video compilations.

Now, NE undoubtedly has it down to a science but I think the Steelers of the past couple of years are at least trying to get into the 21st century. They have a LOT of old dogs in that scouting department, though.

That's all well and good. And, I don't expect them to be perfect at it in a very short period of time, but the problem I have is when your head coach has that info at his deposal but throws it all out the window and let his 'gut' take over come situational football time. Unless you're an X's & O's/game clock manager whisperer (which he's not), it's stupid, just plain stupid (and arrogant).

He says shit like that, but they appear to do a lot of things that make sense analytically.

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 Post subject: Re: Watching The Eagles' Coaches Decisions/Plays I Felt Jeal
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 2:01 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
He says shit like that, but they appear to do a lot of things that make sense analytically.

Like let time needlessly run off the clock instead of calling a TO? Which is one of the simpler concepts.

I just find it hard to believe given the obvious mistakes routinely made.


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