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 Post subject: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2019 8:15 pm 
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https://twitter.com/steel_curtain4/status/1113570583374180353?s=21

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Blitzburgh
‏ @Steel_Curtain4

Per @gerrydulac, the main reason for the holdup with Ben's contract extension is that his agent represents Carson Wentz, Jared Goff and Marcus Mariota, who are all in the process of getting new deals. What they'll receive will help indicate what to expect from the #Steelers.


Ben should get his but he has been getting his for a long time now. Just tell his agent what number is right and get it done give or take a million per season.

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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2019 9:46 pm 
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LETS get it done


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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 11:51 am 
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"The Seattle Seahawks and Russell Wilson have reached agreement on a four-year, $140 million extension that includes a $65 million signing bonus "


Ben is getting a big, big raise.

QB is far and away the most valuable position in football. $35M per year is pretty ridiculous, in comparison to other players.

You would think the union would fight to cap top contracts or have some sort of max deal like they do in the NBA. Would leave a lot more money for all the other players. It's crazy to me that you have a hard salary cap and the union is OK with nearly 20% of that going to one player. Basically about 8 guys on every team take over 50% of the money.

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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:08 pm 
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Kodiak wrote:
"The Seattle Seahawks and Russell Wilson have reached agreement on a four-year, $140 million extension that includes a $65 million signing bonus "


Ben is getting a big, big raise.

QB is far and away the most valuable position in football. $35M per year is pretty ridiculous, in comparison to other players.

You would think the union would fight to cap top contracts or have some sort of max deal like they do in the NBA. Would leave a lot more money for all the other players. It's crazy to me that you have a hard salary cap and the union is OK with nearly 20% of that going to one player. Basically about 8 guys on every team take over 50% of the money.

That's because it's not really a union, in the sense of say coal miners. It's a guild or a loose cartel. It exists for the benefit of the top 1-10%. That's who the PA argues for, it's who the owners care about. The important parts of the agreement for either are all about the stars. The rest of it is window dressing that they probably have worked out before they sit down and posture.

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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:32 pm 
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Kodiak wrote:
You would think the union would fight to cap top contracts or have some sort of max deal like they do in the NBA. Would leave a lot more money for all the other players. It's crazy to me that you have a hard salary cap and the union is OK with nearly 20% of that going to one player. Basically about 8 guys on every team take over 50% of the money.

Steph Curry eats 37% of Golden State's total cap space, and is 26% of their total payroll.
Lebron is 40% of the Lakers salaries.
In Boston, 4 players eat 75% of the total payroll.

This is common across all sports. The difference in football is these max salaries are tied to one position exclusively.

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Last edited by Pabst on Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:34 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
Kodiak wrote:
"The Seattle Seahawks and Russell Wilson have reached agreement on a four-year, $140 million extension that includes a $65 million signing bonus "


Ben is getting a big, big raise.

QB is far and away the most valuable position in football. $35M per year is pretty ridiculous, in comparison to other players.

You would think the union would fight to cap top contracts or have some sort of max deal like they do in the NBA. Would leave a lot more money for all the other players. It's crazy to me that you have a hard salary cap and the union is OK with nearly 20% of that going to one player. Basically about 8 guys on every team take over 50% of the money.

That's because it's not really a union, in the sense of say coal miners. It's a guild or a loose cartel. It exists for the benefit of the top 1-10%. That's who the PA argues for, it's who the owners care about. The important parts of the agreement for either are all about the stars. The rest of it is window dressing that they probably have worked out before they sit down and posture.


Yes and no. The rank and file of the NFLPA has voted for things that do not favor the 1-10%. Franchise tag for one. Most things they do tend to benefit the 90%.

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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:42 pm 
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jebrick wrote:
Yes and no. The rank and file of the NFLPA has voted for things that do not favor the 1-10%. Franchise tag for one. Most things they do tend to benefit the 90%.


I'm not sure how the franchise tag really benefits the 90%.

I think the point is the rank-and-file have the votes to demand much more, but don't.

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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:14 pm 
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Kodiak wrote:
jebrick wrote:
Yes and no. The rank and file of the NFLPA has voted for things that do not favor the 1-10%. Franchise tag for one. Most things they do tend to benefit the 90%.


I'm not sure how the franchise tag really benefits the 90%.

I think the point is the rank-and-file have the votes to demand much more, but don't.


It does not benefit the best players. If the top 10% of the players could do one thing they would get rid of the franchise tag

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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:32 pm 
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The Tag benefits the rank and file by raising the average wages paid to the position. Every time someone franchises a kicker or a punter, for instance, that has the effect of raising the floor for veterans at that position. The top players don't like it because they are in line for big, guaranteed contracts with large signing bonuses, and the Tag keeps them from that.

The example I always thought was interesting, because you are handing over a big bag of cash to a player with no long term commitment from them when you tag them, was Jason Worilds, who basically took the 9ish million from his tag, played the season, then rode off into his life's work with a nice chunk of set for life in his wallet, as long as it was well-invested, or just not pissed away. Surprised that doesn't happen more often.


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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 2:50 pm 
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Ice wrote:
The Tag benefits the rank and file by raising the average wages paid to the position.


I don't see how that drives contracts of the average players. The market for franchise players is different than your average role players.

The franchise tag exists as a concession to the owners. It doesn't benefit the 90%.

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Proven - Tomlin is not good at X's and O's.
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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:09 pm 
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Kodiak wrote:
Ice wrote:
The Tag benefits the rank and file by raising the average wages paid to the position.


I don't see how that drives contracts of the average players. The market for franchise players is different than your average role players.

The franchise tag exists as a concession to the owners. It doesn't benefit the 90%.

THIS^^^

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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 7:26 pm 
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I see a lot of butt average players getting pretty fat contracts annually on the first day or three of FA every year. Positional values driven up by the tag don't help drive that market?

I'll grant it essentially gives two team options to team ownership, but it does push salaries, and from a cap management standpoint, may have nudged teams in the direction of being able to manage large amounts of cash doled out under the cap in one season, paving the way for bigger money deals.


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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 10:09 pm 
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I wish Ben would just take a lesser 2 or 3 year deal to help the team out and allow us to have more money to pursue free agents. That may sound crazy, but come on, he is one of the richest QBs over the course of his career. Many QBs sign big contracts but never see the end of it.

He signed a what was it?, $23 million rookie contract.

Then on his 2nd contract got $88 million.

And his current contract was a 4 year $87 million deal.

So that is just shy of $200 million. Does Ben want to sign a 3 year extension for $100 million and hamstring the team, or does he want to sign for a lesser amount to help the Steelers assemble a team to win another championship??

With everything that has happened the past two seasons with Brown and Bell wanting to get paid, placing themselves above the team with their unreasonable demands, it would be refreshing and a tone setter for Ben to say, look, yeah, I can play that game too, try and milk every last dime I can out of the Steelers for this last contract. Or...

...I can take less, change the toxic culture of this team, lead by example and urge the team to splurge in free agency with that saved money so that I can win another championship and cement my legacy.

Easy for me to say that, but if I had already earned close to $200 million I know which one I would do if I really cared about winning.

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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 10:17 pm 
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I hope he crushes this deal to the point it sets Bell and Brown on fire with envy and explode the twitter-grams.

Then goes on to win a SB anyway.


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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 10:44 pm 
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I hope most is guranteed money to piss off the two morons


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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2019 2:11 am 
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Scunge wrote:
I wish Ben would just take a lesser 2 or 3 year deal to help the team out and allow us to have more money to pursue free agents.


Totally nailed it.

But maybe Ben knows he'll never win another title with Mr. Aviators......why leave money on the table just so the retarded braintrust can throw it away?

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Proven - Tomlin is not a leader of men.
Proven - Tomlin does not run a tight locker room.
Proven - Tomlin is not good at X's and O's.
Proven - Tomlin is bad at game management.
Given - 31 other teams would have fired Tomlin long ago.


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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2019 2:15 am 
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Ice wrote:
...but it does push salaries, and from a cap management standpoint, may have nudged teams in the direction of being able to manage large amounts of cash...


Not at all...

If anything, it actually suppresses salaries. The FT keeps guys from going to the highest bidder in a bidding war free agency....And most people actually end-up taking less for security and guaranteed money.

Where you're not wrong is that the FT chips away at the max value those guys could get, and so there's a few bucks leftover for the scrubs.

But the rub of it is the FT has absolutely nothing to do with helping the "90%".

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Proven - Tomlin is not good at X's and O's.
Proven - Tomlin is bad at game management.
Given - 31 other teams would have fired Tomlin long ago.


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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2019 10:20 am 
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Unless you consider kickers, punters, 2nd string corners, etc part of the "10%," it's not entirely a cross for the "90%" to bear. Like I said, it does make Ownership's life easier to an extent, but like all things collectively bargained, it's at the very least a slightly double-edged sword. That said, barely worth us going back and forth about on a website. I'll agree to somewhat agree and somewhat disagree.


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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2019 11:45 pm 
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Ice wrote:
I'll agree to somewhat agree and somewhat disagree.


Fair enough. Enjoyed the discussion.

Frankly, I think the next CBA is going to be very, very interesting....with AB and Bell being Exhibits A & B that both sides will be anxious to address. Also, I think the players realized pretty quickly in the last deal that giving away their rights with respect to discipline and fines to Goodell was a mistake.

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Proven - Tomlin is not a leader of men.
Proven - Tomlin does not run a tight locker room.
Proven - Tomlin is not good at X's and O's.
Proven - Tomlin is bad at game management.
Given - 31 other teams would have fired Tomlin long ago.


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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2019 11:53 pm 
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I think the Rooneys may have caught wind of some of Ben's anti-Irish tirades this past offseason. There may be no extension in the making afterall.

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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 8:59 am 
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Kodiak wrote:
Ice wrote:
I'll agree to somewhat agree and somewhat disagree.


Fair enough. Enjoyed the discussion.

Frankly, I think the next CBA is going to be very, very interesting....with AB and Bell being Exhibits A & B that both sides will be anxious to address. Also, I think the players realized pretty quickly in the last deal that giving away their rights with respect to discipline and fines to Goodell was a mistake.


I think the owners will "cave" on the discipline "system" to avoid changes that will push salaries up, without hesitation.

I'm not sure if AB is a test case for much. If the Steelers had wanted to play hardball with him, they could have. He was under contract. Unless you want to enact some method to force players to sign their tags, I'm not sure what you can do about Bell, either. The Steelers could have given him everything they wanted, and they didn't. He chose not to sign the tag, and lost himself a large amount of unrecoverable salary to keep himself fresh for 2019 free agency.


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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 10:41 pm 
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Kodiak wrote:
I think the players realized pretty quickly in the last deal that giving away their rights with respect to discipline and fines to Goodell was a mistake.


31 teams accepted it. 1 team stood up and said what need to be said while everyone else just thought we had sour grapes over the way Harrison got treated. They made the bed and we had to lay in it even though Pittsburgh warned them all.

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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2019 2:48 am 
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stillthere wrote:
31 teams accepted it. 1 team stood up and said what need to be said while everyone else just thought we had sour grapes over the way Harrison got treated. They made the bed and we had to lay in it even though Pittsburgh warned them all.


No one disagrees.

I've thought for some time this was a brilliant play to bring a negotiating chip the owners didn't really care about.

And if players cave on that, then they're dumb [which, of course, they are]. It affects a very small % of players - back to the whole "insurance isn't rational" argument.

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Proven - Tomlin is not good at X's and O's.
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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 12:00 pm 
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Scunge wrote:
I wish Ben would just take a lesser 2 or 3 year deal to help the team out and allow us to have more money to pursue free agents. That may sound crazy, but come on, he is one of the richest QBs over the course of his career. Many QBs sign big contracts but never see the end of it.

He signed a what was it?, $23 million rookie contract.

Then on his 2nd contract got $88 million.

And his current contract was a 4 year $87 million deal.

So that is just shy of $200 million. Does Ben want to sign a 3 year extension for $100 million and hamstring the team, or does he want to sign for a lesser amount to help the Steelers assemble a team to win another championship??

With everything that has happened the past two seasons with Brown and Bell wanting to get paid, placing themselves above the team with their unreasonable demands, it would be refreshing and a tone setter for Ben to say, look, yeah, I can play that game too, try and milk every last dime I can out of the Steelers for this last contract. Or...

...I can take less, change the toxic culture of this team, lead by example and urge the team to splurge in free agency with that saved money so that I can win another championship and cement my legacy.

Easy for me to say that, but if I had already earned close to $200 million I know which one I would do if I really cared about winning.

Have you ever thought that The Steelers wouldn't want to do this? Some bullshit statement to the world that we are standing by our man? Pay him what he is worth or more?

I wouldn't put this by the weirdo ArtDay2.


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 Post subject: Re: Ben extension info
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:37 pm 
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Quote:
ESPN's Adam Schefter reports the Steelers are "working hard" to complete an extension for contract-year QB Ben Roethlisberger before the start of the draft.
The 37-year-old Roethlisberger has been playing on his current deal since 2015. Although he is not the playmaker outside the pocket he once was, Big Ben has shown extremely little drop off. He has also shown increased durability, missing just one game over the past two years. Roethlisberger's leadership remains a question mark, but he is a good bet for 2-3 more strong seasons.

SOURCE: Adam Schefter on Twitter
Apr 23, 2019, 5:48 PM


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