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 Post subject: Re: Tuitt 5Y/$60M
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:00 pm 
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Awesome. Just got back from seeing the movie IT! Glad they got it done. Now..., on to a winning season and Super Bowl victory.

Quote:
"This is one of the best organizations to be a part of, especially for a guy like me," Tuitt told Steelers.com. "I (came in) as a young guy, super raw. I have some great coaches who have helped me and I have seen my game pick up, my confidence level rise, my leadership ability rise. Being a part of an organization like this, I can see why a lot of great players come from here, a lot of Hall of Fame players come from here."
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/2064 ... -extension

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 Post subject: Re: Tuitt 5Y/$60M
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:11 pm 
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This time, with all sincerity:

CHAMPIONSHIP!

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 Post subject: Re: Tuitt 5Y/$60M
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:23 pm 
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Steelers defensive lineman Stephon Tuitt didn’t get a big contract as a rookie in 2014. He has one now, just as the last year of his first contract was set to begin.

Per a source with knowledge of the deal, here are the full details:

1. $11 million signing bonus;

2. $1 million base salary for 2017;

3. $2 million 2017 roster bonus due in three days;

4. $7.5 million roster bonus due on the fifth day of the 2018 league year;

5. $3.5 million salary for 2018;

6. $3 million roster bonus due on the fifth day of the 2019 league year;

7. $6 million salary for 2019;

8. $9 million salary for 2020;

9. $9 million salary for 2021;

10. $9.05 million salary for 2022.

Here are the highlights of the deal:

1. Tuitt was due to make $1.048560 this year; he’ll make $14 million instead.

2. He’ll make $24 million in new money over the first two years of the deal.

3. There’s no guarantee beyond year one, which is consistent with all Steelers long-term deals. However, they rarely cut a player who has signed a long-term contract after one year. If they do, Tuitt will have gotten $14 million for one year and an early trip to the open market, thanks to the early trigger on the roster bonus.

https://sports.yahoo.com/full-stephon-t ... 47230.html

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 Post subject: Re: Tuitt 5Y/$60M
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:26 pm 
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Jobus Rum wrote:
Overpaid...once again, the Steelers bidding against themselves.


I'm not sure, and I'm one of the biggest critics of that. I haven't done a comparison, but the way the cap is going up there are 2-3 guys every year at a position getting "top 3-5 money"....so the 2-3 guys up for a contract every year will get at least a little more than the guys who did their deals 3+ years ago - a guy who might barely be top-10 at his position is going to get top-5 money at the time of his deal.

And Tuitt is one of the more exceptional 3-4 guys capable of consistently collapsing the pocket. So I think this is a pretty fair and reasonable deal.

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 Post subject: Re: Tuitt 5Y/$60M
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:38 pm 
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Steelafan77 wrote:
There’s no guarantee beyond year one, which is consistent with all Steelers long-term deals. However, they rarely cut a player who has signed a long-term contract after one year. If they do, Tuitt will have gotten $14 million for one year and an early trip to the open market, thanks to the early trigger on the roster bonus.


That is what I don't get, and IMO the Steelers are dinosaurs when it comes to contract structures:
1) guys are very, very rarely cut after just 1-2 years of a big new deal, ESPECIALLY a C2...why not save a few bucks on the cap long-term giving them guaranteed money you're going to pay anyway, in trade for lower total dollars ? Steelers shy away from large SB (which costs them cap long-term) for some kind of irrational extreme risk aversion.

2) related to the above, the Steelers typically end-up with the same dead cap liabilities, anyway, when they restructure these deals a year or two in to create cap space (some of which they've pissed away because they're afraid of big guarantees).

3) you don't need to be afraid of big guarantees because the really savvy GM's are guaranteeing the first 2-3 years of salary because they KNOW there's a 99.9% chance they are paying the guy at least 3 years. That practice reduces potential dead cap money in yrs 4-6 when a guy actually has a more reasonable chance to be cut or traded.

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 Post subject: Re: Tuitt 5Y/$60M
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:38 pm 
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Kodiak wrote:
Jobus Rum wrote:
Overpaid...once again, the Steelers bidding against themselves.


I'm not sure, and I'm one of the biggest critics of that. I haven't done a comparison, but the way the cap is going up there are 2-3 guys every year at a position getting "top 3-5 money"....so the 2-3 guys up for a contract every year will get at least a little more than the guys who did their deals 3+ years ago - a guy who might barely be top-10 at his position is going to get top-5 money at the time of his deal.

And Tuitt is one of the more exceptional 3-4 guys capable of consistently collapsing the pocket. So I think this is a pretty fair and reasonable deal.

I know you understand the numbers side of this stuff more than most, certainly more than me. And what you have posted makes sense, it's the way the system works. But I believe that we tend to overrate certain Steelers players, and I believe Tuitt is one of those players. Now, I think he's a nice player, and certainly important to this defense, but I don't believe he's the stud we want to make him out to be.
But hey... he's cashed in, so good for him. Now go out and help this team win a Lombardi or three.

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 Post subject: Re: Tuitt 5Y/$60M
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:39 pm 
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Great news on Tuitt.


Last edited by Havoc on Sun Sep 10, 2017 8:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Tuitt 5Y/$60M
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:43 pm 
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If you are going to "overpay" for a player do it for a guy like Tuitt. A super-young, stud on the defensive line with many prime years still in front of him. Money much better spent than on, let's say, a RB.

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 Post subject: Re: Tuitt 5Y/$60M
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:45 pm 
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Jobus Rum wrote:
But I believe that we tend to overrate certain Steelers players, and I believe Tuitt is one of those players. Now, I think he's a nice player, and certainly important to this defense, but I don't believe he's the stud we want to make him out to be.
But hey... he's cashed in, so good for him. Now go out and help this team win a Lombardi or three.


All fair points.

They weren't going to have a franchise tag if they intend to use that on Bell (and you wouldn't do that with Tuitt because you're talking $16.5M+). You could use the transition tag for the chance to match, but the problem is some teams have loads of cap space they have to spend somewhere, and guys of Tuitt's caliber rarely hit the open market any more...meaning he - anyone of that caliber - is going to be highly overvalued as a FA and you wouldn't be able to match.

If NFL ratings decline again this year, some of these contracts are going to look a lot richer when cap increases flat-line.

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 Post subject: Re: Tuitt 5Y/$60M
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:51 pm 
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Smashmouth21 wrote:
If you are going to "overpay" for a player do it for a guy like Tuitt. A super-young, stud on the defensive line with many prime years still in front of him. Money much better spent than on, let's say, a RB.


I said before, but it seems like most teams target 8-10 core guys on big C2/C3 contracts. The Steelers are fairly top heavy at the moment, but the situation is a little different (and warranted) when you have a franchise QB coming off the books in a few years vs. one coming onto the books in a few years (consider even a mediocre QB like Alex Smith averages $17M a year).....In other words, in a few years PIT won't have to pay a boatload to a QB for at least a few years, so they can afford to carry a couple more big contracts the next couple of years.

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