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 Post subject: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 12:09 pm 
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I thought this deserved a thread of it's own.

I am interested in everyone's thoughts on why we haven't seen the dynamic playmaker we expected.

Where is the dynamic natural runner weaving thru traffic making guys miss? Did he bulk up too much?

Is this a matter of sample size?

Is it as simple as Haley underutilizing him?

We need this guy to be a playmaker for us. It has to still be in there somewhere. How can we get it back?

Edit: I did not intend to start a 2nd thread on Bryant.


Last edited by Havoc on Thu Oct 12, 2017 12:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 12:12 pm 
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Havoc wrote:
I thought this deserved a thread of it's own.

I am interested in everyone's thoughts on why we haven't seen the dynamic playmaker we expected.

Where is the dynamic natural runner weaving thru traffic making guys miss? Did he bulk up too much?

Is this a matter of sample size?

Is it as simple as Haley underutilizing him?

We need this guy to be a playmaker for us. It has to still be in there somewhere. How can we get it back?


I definitely don't think he bulked up too much. I'd say it's a combo of scheme, rust, and lack of mental focus.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 12:31 pm 
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Seeing him on field in person on Sunday, with and without pads says, no did not bulk up too much. May have dropped back down a bit with training camp.

I think a a few problems can be.
1. He is not a very accomplished route Runner. Or at least his route tree is limited.
2. There should be two, three or more simple curls or 7/8 yard outs per game that should be easy completions given his speed and deep threat. He needs to get very good at running this route selling long stopping and turning.
3. Incorporating these simple pass plays is part of offensive game planning and play calling. We don't see enough of it.
4. Offensive strategy game planning and play calling is very unimaginative and predictable. There are so many more things that you could do with Martavis Bryant.
5. He should be streaking in motion more often with a threat of a handoff, and around, fake handoff, or at minimum a running start into the secondary. It will create more confusion and movement of linebackers and safeties. We Stand still most of the time.

I think not having him more Incorporated in game planand play calling starts with the head coach, oc and Ben.... the three headed masterminds of our offense.

Taking a helmet away from him this coming Sunday will be a mistake it could lead to a down spiral that will be detrimental to him and the team.

I see very little out of Justin Hunter to justify giving him a helmet over Bryant. I think he is just as Limited in his routes as Bryant. And looks like a pencil with the uniform on as he may be a buck 90 in his six foot three frame.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 12:38 pm 
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I didn't mean to start a 2nd thread on Bryant.

Mods feel free to delete this one if you want.


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 2:04 pm 
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Havoc wrote:
I thought this deserved a thread of it's own.

I am interested in everyone's thoughts on why we haven't seen the dynamic playmaker we expected.

Where is the dynamic natural runner weaving thru traffic making guys miss? Did he bulk up too much?

Is this a matter of sample size?

Is it as simple as Haley underutilizing him?

We need this guy to be a playmaker for us. It has to still be in there somewhere. How can we get it back?

Edit: I did not intend to start a 2nd thread on Bryant.


He looked good on the TD he housed a while back. It is the patented U Offense. We have an offense that should be able to attack everywhere, which fucks up a defense. We turned a fucking Stallion into a glue horse.


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 2:29 pm 
Imo ?

Haley
Haley
Zero camp
Haley
Zero football for a year+
Haley


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 2:33 pm 
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Zeke5123 wrote:
Havoc wrote:
I thought this deserved a thread of it's own.

I am interested in everyone's thoughts on why we haven't seen the dynamic playmaker we expected.

Where is the dynamic natural runner weaving thru traffic making guys miss? Did he bulk up too much?

Is this a matter of sample size?

Is it as simple as Haley underutilizing him?

We need this guy to be a playmaker for us. It has to still be in there somewhere. How can we get it back?

Edit: I did not intend to start a 2nd thread on Bryant.


He looked good on the TD he housed a while back. It is the patented U Offense. We have an offense that should be able to attack everywhere, which fucks up a defense. We turned a fucking Stallion into a glue horse.


I hear you. Why have we so blatantly gone back to the U? I hate the U shaped passing game with a passion as do many of us. It's like we have gone back in time to Haley's first couple years here.

I agree Bryant did look good on the TD... but that was a burst of speed which is good of course.


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 2:35 pm 
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SteelerChef wrote:
Imo ?

Haley
Haley
Zero camp
Haley
Zero football for a year+
Haley


Pretty much.


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 2:51 pm 
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Stosh-67 wrote:
Seeing him on field in person on Sunday, with and without pads says, no did not bulk up too much. May have dropped back down a bit with training camp.

I think a a few problems can be.
1. He is not a very accomplished route Runner. Or at least his route tree is limited.
2. There should be two, three or more simple curls or 7/8 yard outs per game that should be easy completions given his speed and deep threat. He needs to get very good at running this route selling long stopping and turning.
3. Incorporating these simple pass plays is part of offensive game planning and play calling. We don't see enough of it.
4. Offensive strategy game planning and play calling is very unimaginative and predictable. There are so many more things that you could do with Martavis Bryant.
5. He should be streaking in motion more often with a threat of a handoff, and around, fake handoff, or at minimum a running start into the secondary. It will create more confusion and movement of linebackers and safeties. We Stand still most of the time.

I think not having him more Incorporated in game planand play calling starts with the head coach, oc and Ben.... the three headed masterminds of our offense.

Taking a helmet away from him this coming Sunday will be a mistake it could lead to a down spiral that will be detrimental to him and the team.

I see very little out of Justin Hunter to justify giving him a helmet over Bryant. I think he is just as Limited in his routes as Bryant. And looks like a pencil with the uniform on as he may be a buck 90 in his six foot three frame.


Good thoughts, Stosh

I am also thinking of Haley saying to Bryant (the Alien version) on the sideline... "I've never had a player like you" (or something similar to that).

It seemed to me, that Haley loved what Bryant brought to the table.

And now we have news that Bryant might be seeing the bench.

I wonder is something is missing from this equation.


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:26 pm 
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Havoc wrote:
I wonder is something is missing from this equation.


I've only seen him really separate like once or twice on go routes.

I wonder if he hasn't lost a step with the extra 20-30 lbs. On the other hand, most world-class sprinters are built like LBers. I don't know.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:39 pm 
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He's just rusty and the offense as a whole has as well. Hopefully they get this thing going soon, because this offense should have no problems putting up 30 a game.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 4:13 pm 
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smithessmokin wrote:
He's just rusty and the offense as a whole has as well.


We're heading into Wk6. How much longer can we use this as an excuse?

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 4:34 pm 
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I guess what really annoys me is we need a weapon. Use the weapon right before you bench him. Going to a guy like Eli is just being conservative. Eli will be able to run your safe routes and likely will move the chains. He won't be a difference maker. Bryant can be a difference maker. Put him in a position to succeed.


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 5:42 pm 
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Kodiak wrote:
Havoc wrote:
I wonder is something is missing from this equation.


I've only seen him really separate like once or twice on go routes.

I wonder if he hasn't lost a step with the extra 20-30 lbs. On the other hand, most world-class sprinters are built like LBers. I don't know.


Exactly my thoughts.

I was concerned about this even in the preseason. I was looking for that dynamic yac guy and never saw it although with very limited reps. But like you stated, world class sprinters... so I don't know either. It does concern me though.

He looks like a different guy to me. But maybe it's just lack of opportunity.

At this point, I like the thin version of Martavis better unless proven otherwise.


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:16 pm 
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Unreasonably high expectations for an above average athlete with a below average brain.
Overrated play the last year he had a helmet.

He got lucky with a few plays with YAC, and fans anointed him the second coming of randy moss.

Now that he's not that lucky, someone else is to blame, he's rusty, or put on too much weight.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:30 pm 
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COR-TEN wrote:
Unreasonably high expectations for an above average athlete with a below average brain.
Overrated play the last year he had a helmet.

He got lucky with a few plays with YAC, and fans anointed him the second coming of randy moss.

Now that he's not that lucky, someone else is to blame, he's rusty, or put on too much weight.


Bryant has always been highly overrated by some. The Moss comparisons were always a farce.

Not sure how you can get lucky with YAC though.

Maybe he's a guy who peaked and was never going to get better. See Mike Wallace.


Last edited by Havoc on Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:40 pm 
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Bryant can take the top off the D if Ben can get him the ball.
R we outsmarting ourselves again?
Guess we’ll find out Sunday.


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:42 pm 
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punum123 wrote:
Bryant can take the top off the D if Ben can get him the ball.


But is that even theoretically possible in a U-shaped offensive attack?

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:45 pm 
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Havoc wrote:
COR-TEN wrote:
Unreasonably high expectations for an above average athlete with a below average brain.
Overrated play the last year he had a helmet.

He got lucky with a few plays with YAC, and fans anointed him the second coming of randy moss.

Now that he's not that lucky, someone else is to blame, he's rusty, or put on too much weight.


Bryant has always been highly overrated by some. The Moss comparisons were always a farce.

Not sure how you can get lucky with YAC though.

I'm leaning toward he has lost a slight amount of in space quickness. Maybe his body type just doesn't carry that extra bulk like some guys can. Body types are different.

I don't know though. I need to see more of him this year.

Maybe it's something else.

Or maybe he's a guy who peaked and was never going to get better. See Mike Wallace.
Check out this TD.



The Cards defense were a bunch of bumbling fools, taking wrong angles and sloppy with their pursuit.

He got lucky, imo.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:50 pm 
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COR-TEN wrote:
Check out this TD.



The Cards defense were a bunch of bumbling fools, taking wrong angles and sloppy with their pursuit.

He got lucky, imo.


A fair point. The YAC consisted of 2 cutbacks. Wasn't much picking his way thru traffic.


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:11 pm 
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Bryant was never consistent. When he was, he was a superstar. And now it looks as if he is taking time getting his act back together.

But he's been wide open 3 times...twice for easy TDs. It would help if Ben didn't miss him by a country mile when he he was.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:18 pm 
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He may need to get stoned and think about it for a while.


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:39 pm 
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Kodiak wrote:
smithessmokin wrote:
He's just rusty and the offense as a whole has as well.


We're heading into Wk6. How much longer can we use this as an excuse?

It's not an excuse, it's a fact. This team isn't on the same page and haven't been because of the dumbfuckery at training camp.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:40 pm 
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I was always afraid that we were overaging MB. Remember, in college this guy was always Robin to someone else’s Batman.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:45 pm 
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If you watch the big go route from Sunday, he was severely arm barred the whole route. I think it should have been called! It definitely moved him laterally about 4-5 yards. Like a sideways wind on an airplane. The ball landed to his left too. I believe it was a perfectly thrown ball.


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