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 Post subject: Re: Ref. Season # 6: Steelers @ Chiefs Game Comments
PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 1:10 pm 
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Still Lit wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
Why is it accepted as a fact that Ben doesn't work out in the offseason and that he doesn't study?

Whatever.

I think Ben and offense left some plays on the field, which is actually a good thing when you can still say you won and when you can still point to obvious signs of improvement in both approach and execution. Bet you Ben looks a whole lot less "rusty" and "average" if they get into the flow of the passing game and use of the middle of the field.

Yesterday was exhibit A of what's been missing from the Steelers offensive plan: better run blocking, better protection, better flow for the RB, use of the intermediate middle, spreading the ball around.


Oh everyone agrees he works out. The disagreement is over whether his workouts are a fucking joke compared to what other QBs do to be in the best physical shape for their particular position. Ben has two fucking chins. He doesn't need to look like Bell or AB but come on B2B. You can't possibly think Ben does everything he can to be in peak possible shape. At his age and with his wear he needs to.

The notion that longevity has nothing to do with conditioning strikes me as utterly absurd.

I usually agree with most everything b2b states Steelers wise, but this is where I don't. It surprises me that he seems pretty open-minded to most critiques about players, but it seems he refuses to use his eyes and ears when it comes to Ben' conditioning and film study habits as compared to some of the other "elite" QBs his age or older. These two areas are extremely important for longevity and effectiveness at this stage of his career, imo. If he was really driven to work as hard in those areas he could be so much more...dare I say GOAT. I guess having great physical abilities can be a detriment sometimes. Doing less with more instead of more with less...


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 Post subject: Re: Ref. Season # 6: Steelers @ Chiefs Game Comments
PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 1:45 pm 
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Ben's film study and presnap reads are absolutely among the best in the league. You can argue postsnap reads or decision-making, if you like, but I definitely don't get where Ben doesn't study comes from. 2004? That's a long time ago, and by 2009 he was pretty advanced in that regard.

As for offseason routine-- I'm merely saying we have no idea, really, how hard he works or what his goals and the goals set for him by the team's strength & conditioning people are. For all we know, they advocated him building some bulk to take the hits.

I don't think Ben is some kind of elite athlete, but he's not really made like that. For all of Brady's diet and workout, he doesn't look like one, either.

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 Post subject: Re: Ref. Season # 6: Steelers @ Chiefs Game Comments
PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 1:54 pm 
America 2017 B2B

Spread enough bullshit, half truths, lies, innuendo and it becomes perceived fact


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 Post subject: Re: Ref. Season # 6: Steelers @ Chiefs Game Comments
PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 1:57 pm 
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SteelerChef wrote:
America 2017 B2B

Spread enough bullshit, half truths, lies, innuendo and it becomes perceived fact
Placing B2B in the same arena as america is just plain stupid and trolling. Please. Shut.The.Fuck.Up. Go back to grease pushing.

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 Post subject: Re: Ref. Season # 6: Steelers @ Chiefs Game Comments
PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:02 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
Ben's film study and presnap reads are absolutely among the best in the league. You can argue postsnap reads or decision-making, if you like, but I definitely don't get where Ben doesn't study comes from. 2004? That's a long time ago, and by 2009 he was pretty advanced in that regard.

As for offseason routine-- I'm merely saying we have no idea, really, how hard he works or what his goals and the goals set for him by the team's strength & conditioning people are. For all we know, they advocated him building some bulk to take the hits.

I don't think Ben is some kind of elite athlete, but he's not really made like that. For all of Brady's diet and workout, he doesn't look like one, either.

How can you say that Ben's film study are among the best in the league, but brush off his lack of conditioning by saying that we simply have no idea what his off season regimen is? Seems like you want to have it both ways.

Brady is twice the athlete Ben is at this point, his movement within the pocket is light years ahead of Ben. We're not expecting Ben to be the lean guy he was out of university, but his footwork and lateral movement really hinders his ability to avoid the rush.


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 Post subject: Re: Ref. Season # 6: Steelers @ Chiefs Game Comments
PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:20 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
Ben's film study and presnap reads are absolutely among the best in the league. You can argue postsnap reads or decision-making, if you like, but I definitely don't get where Ben doesn't study comes from. 2004? That's a long time ago, and by 2009 he was pretty advanced in that regard.

As for offseason routine-- I'm merely saying we have no idea, really, how hard he works or what his goals and the goals set for him by the team's strength & conditioning people are. For all we know, they advocated him building some bulk to take the hits.

I don't think Ben is some kind of elite athlete, but he's not really made like that. For all of Brady's diet and workout, he doesn't look like one, either.

It's been a few years, but I know I've heard Ben state multiple times (as well as others close to the team) that he's not a 'huge' film study guy. I also realize that with a lot of experience comes some aptitude in this area. You'll never convince me a football player being in top physical condition can't but help his ability to preform better and stay on the field longer. I get that some positions require a higher degree of that, so that's not what I'm talking about. Again, like I said, I'm comparing Ben to his peers. Brady, Brees, Eli, Peyton (retired now), Rivers, Rodgers, maybe even Ryan and Smith (this year). I seen (read/watch) plenty over the years to confirm those guys work very hard both on film and being at their physical peak. Again, not saying Ben does none of this, just less than some of his peers from what my eyes and ears tell me. The added weight could be for extra cushion, but it could also slow him from avoiding some hits and shortening his career.


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 Post subject: Re: Ref. Season # 6: Steelers @ Chiefs Game Comments
PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:26 pm 
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seabs926 wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
Ben's film study and presnap reads are absolutely among the best in the league. You can argue postsnap reads or decision-making, if you like, but I definitely don't get where Ben doesn't study comes from. 2004? That's a long time ago, and by 2009 he was pretty advanced in that regard.

As for offseason routine-- I'm merely saying we have no idea, really, how hard he works or what his goals and the goals set for him by the team's strength & conditioning people are. For all we know, they advocated him building some bulk to take the hits.

I don't think Ben is some kind of elite athlete, but he's not really made like that. For all of Brady's diet and workout, he doesn't look like one, either.

How can you say that Ben's film study are among the best in the league, but brush off his lack of conditioning by saying that we simply have no idea what his off season regimen is? Seems like you want to have it both ways.

Brady is twice the athlete Ben is at this point, his movement within the pocket is light years ahead of Ben. We're not expecting Ben to be the lean guy he was out of university, but his footwork and lateral movement really hinders his ability to avoid the rush.

IDK, man- few are the lean athlete they were in college. Ben's also a much bigger dude than Brady.

I watch Brady every week-- he wasn't looking so mobile and nimble against a good pass rush that was laying the lumber like yesterday. There is an awful lot of brand perception influence to this argument. Brady's brand is that he's meticulous about diet/exercise/fountain of youth/preparation and that Ben's just out there winging it/eating pizza/getting up off the couch to come to training camp.

It is fair to say, though, that I am basing my opinion of Ben's film study based on what I see on the field/tape and that I am brushing off what Ben looks like to a degree. However. I don't think Ben is fat-- I don't even think he's as heavy he was at peak Ben of a couple of years ago. His legs are definitely at least going if not gone, though.

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 Post subject: Re: Ref. Season # 6: Steelers @ Chiefs Game Comments
PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:39 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
seabs926 wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
Ben's film study and presnap reads are absolutely among the best in the league. You can argue postsnap reads or decision-making, if you like, but I definitely don't get where Ben doesn't study comes from. 2004? That's a long time ago, and by 2009 he was pretty advanced in that regard.

As for offseason routine-- I'm merely saying we have no idea, really, how hard he works or what his goals and the goals set for him by the team's strength & conditioning people are. For all we know, they advocated him building some bulk to take the hits.

I don't think Ben is some kind of elite athlete, but he's not really made like that. For all of Brady's diet and workout, he doesn't look like one, either.

How can you say that Ben's film study are among the best in the league, but brush off his lack of conditioning by saying that we simply have no idea what his off season regimen is? Seems like you want to have it both ways.

Brady is twice the athlete Ben is at this point, his movement within the pocket is light years ahead of Ben. We're not expecting Ben to be the lean guy he was out of university, but his footwork and lateral movement really hinders his ability to avoid the rush.

IDK, man- few are the lean athlete they were in college. Ben's also a much bigger dude than Brady.

I watch Brady every week-- he wasn't looking so mobile and nimble against a good pass rush that was laying the lumber like yesterday. There is an awful lot of brand perception influence to this argument. Brady's brand is that he's meticulous about diet/exercise/fountain of youth/preparation and that Ben's just out there winging it/eating pizza/getting up off the couch to come to training camp.

It is fair to say, though, that I am basing my opinion of Ben's film study based on what I see on the field/tape and that I am brushing off what Ben looks like to a degree. However. I don't think Ben is fat-- I don't even think he's as heavy he was at peak Ben of a couple of years ago. His legs are definitely at least going if not gone, though.

To be fair, I'm comparing 35 yo Brady to 35 yo Ben. But, when I watch just the degree that Brees works on his form just compensate for not being 6' 5" so he can throw/release from a higher platform it makes me feel Ben could certainly do more. When I look at/read about Brady, Brees and Rodgers I see guys doing just about everything they can to get the most out of what god gave them. I don't see the same level from Ben, sorry. I see 110% with those guys and maybe 100% with Ben.


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 Post subject: Re: Ref. Season # 6: Steelers @ Chiefs Game Comments
PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 4:32 pm 
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COR-TEN wrote:
SteelerChef wrote:
America 2017 B2B

Spread enough bullshit, half truths, lies, innuendo and it becomes perceived fact
Placing B2B in the same arena as america is just plain stupid and trolling. Please. Shut.The.Fuck.Up. Go back to grease pushing.


A heartfelt thank you for this post.


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 Post subject: Re: Ref. Season # 6: Steelers @ Chiefs Game Comments
PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 4:38 pm 
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Ben couldn't avoid Stephen Hawking at this point.

Even if Hawking lost one wheel.

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