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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Fri Nov 03, 2017 3:52 pm 
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SP wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
You know he had 4 tackles vs the run on Sunday night, right?

First four all season. That's the problem.


But it's an improvement

He ain't no Artie Choke

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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Fri Nov 03, 2017 4:12 pm 
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I'm merely saying he didn't avoid contact this week, so either he's feeling better or someone coached him, or something.

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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Fri Nov 03, 2017 5:58 pm 
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A lot of people including myself have been calling for years for corners that cover first and tackle second.
Burns can cover, I’m good with that.


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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Fri Nov 03, 2017 6:15 pm 
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He only makes the tackle when no one else is around and he's forced to do it. That's not going to cut it against superior teams.


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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Fri Nov 03, 2017 6:18 pm 
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cop1211 wrote:
A lot of people including myself have been calling for years for corners that cover first and tackle second.
Burns can cover, I’m good with that.


You're wrong. I want a leather helmet, sweater wearing, 1940's Grabowski that can break ribs, lost his nose in the war and runs a 5.4 40.

No...I'm wrong. Fuck Colbert for not drafting one, but TWO Rod Woodsons in the last 3 years.

No no...it's all wrong...bring back Cockrell and bench Burns. Ross could tackle the shit out guys between torchings.

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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Fri Nov 03, 2017 6:34 pm 
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What's so unusual about covering the pass and tackling? If the pass is completed, you still have to tackle or stop the run. Elite QB's will pick him apart.


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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Fri Nov 03, 2017 6:35 pm 
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ChicagoSteel wrote:
Fuck Colbert for not drafting one, but TWO Rod Woodsons in the last 3 years.


?? :shock: ??

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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Fri Nov 03, 2017 8:39 pm 
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I am disappointed in Burns this year. I expected a big jump from his rookie year to year two. I don't see it.

Everybody was so down on Ross Cockrell, calling him soft, can't play the run, not physical enough and yet Burns is playing softer than Cockrell ever did. Just don't understand it. And it isn't like he is this shut down CB who you can say hey, we drafted him to be a stud coverage guy. Where are the INTs? The broken up passes? Seems like QBs are targeting him more because Haden is that CB that we want Burns to be, they avoid Haden and throw more at Burns.

When we played Cincy and I got my first chance to watch William Jackson the 3rd, it was eye opening. So, that is what a first round CB is supposed to perform like, tight coverage, playing the catch point, knocking the football out of Antonio Brown's hands. Yes! What we have in Burns in nowhere close to that, and may never be.

I don't know what this season would have been like without Mike Hilton and Joe Haden. If we had gone into this season with Burns, Cockrell and Gay as our trio, we might be lucky to be 4-4.

If people are honest, the two weakest performers on defense are which two players? For me that is Burns and Mitchell. They are the two biggest weaknesses that teams exploit and it isn't even close. One we spent a first round pick on and the other we signed to a 5 year $25 million contract. Not really getting a good return on those investments.

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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Fri Nov 03, 2017 9:16 pm 
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Scunge wrote:
Seems like QBs are targeting him more because Haden is that CB that we want Burns to be, they avoid Haden and throw more at Burns.


To be fair, both are arguably hamstrung by the cushions our defense loves. But Haden being a better match-up for us on #2 receivers doesn't make him bettern than Burns on #1's. Both also have Mike Mitchell having their backs, and like you said....

Burns has gotten beat, and has not been as good as hoped. But I don't think he's been bad by any stretch.

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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Fri Nov 03, 2017 10:30 pm 
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Scunge wrote:
I am disappointed in Burns this year. I expected a big jump from his rookie year to year two. I don't see it.

Everybody was so down on Ross Cockrell, calling him soft, can't play the run, not physical enough and yet Burns is playing softer than Cockrell ever did. Just don't understand it. And it isn't like he is this shut down CB who you can say hey, we drafted him to be a stud coverage guy. Where are the INTs? The broken up passes? Seems like QBs are targeting him more because Haden is that CB that we want Burns to be, they avoid Haden and throw more at Burns.

When we played Cincy and I got my first chance to watch William Jackson the 3rd, it was eye opening. So, that is what a first round CB is supposed to perform like, tight coverage, playing the catch point, knocking the football out of Antonio Brown's hands. Yes! What we have in Burns in nowhere close to that, and may never be.

I don't know what this season would have been like without Mike Hilton and Joe Haden. If we had gone into this season with Burns, Cockrell and Gay as our trio, we might be lucky to be 4-4.

If people are honest, the two weakest performers on defense are which two players? For me that is Burns and Mitchell. They are the two biggest weaknesses that teams exploit and it isn't even close. One we spent a first round pick on and the other we signed to a 5 year $25 million contract. Not really getting a good return on those investments.

Agreed. I laugh when people call Burns a shutdown corner...not even close.

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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Fri Nov 03, 2017 10:36 pm 
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BarryFoster wrote:
SP wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
You know he had 4 tackles vs the run on Sunday night, right?

First four all season. That's the problem.


But it's an improvement

He ain't no Artie Choke


"Mighta choked Arti....ain't gonna choke Stymie!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNSzZvEkoDE


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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Fri Nov 03, 2017 11:12 pm 
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Scunge wrote:
I am disappointed in Burns this year. I expected a big jump from his rookie year to year two. I don't see it.

Everybody was so down on Ross Cockrell, calling him soft, can't play the run, not physical enough and yet Burns is playing softer than Cockrell ever did. Just don't understand it. And it isn't like he is this shut down CB who you can say hey, we drafted him to be a stud coverage guy. Where are the INTs? The broken up passes? Seems like QBs are targeting him more because Haden is that CB that we want Burns to be, they avoid Haden and throw more at Burns.

When we played Cincy and I got my first chance to watch William Jackson the 3rd, it was eye opening. So, that is what a first round CB is supposed to perform like, tight coverage, playing the catch point, knocking the football out of Antonio Brown's hands. Yes! What we have in Burns in nowhere close to that, and may never be.

I don't know what this season would have been like without Mike Hilton and Joe Haden. If we had gone into this season with Burns, Cockrell and Gay as our trio, we might be lucky to be 4-4.

If people are honest, the two weakest performers on defense are which two players? For me that is Burns and Mitchell. They are the two biggest weaknesses that teams exploit and it isn't even close. One we spent a first round pick on and the other we signed to a 5 year $25 million contract. Not really getting a good return on those investments.


Spot on Scrung. $64 question is can he be coached up or he is what he is.


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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Fri Nov 03, 2017 11:37 pm 
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Quote:

"Mighta choked Arti....ain't gonna choke Stymie!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNSzZvEkoDE

Report this post


You are the only one who got my reference

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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Sat Nov 04, 2017 12:00 am 
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Wasn't Artie one of the youngest corners in the draft last year? The kid is young and talented. I think he's playing pretty well with room for improvement. And he has all the tools to improve with experience.


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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Sat Nov 04, 2017 12:57 am 
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Adjusted for opponent rankings:

vs #1 WR 15th
vs#2WR 19th
vs 3rd/4th WR 6th
vs TE 2nd
vs RB 17th.
Burns's side 30th
middle 10th
Haden side 1st
deep 19th
short 5th.
Short on Burns' side 24th, short on Haden side 1st.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamdef

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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Sat Nov 04, 2017 1:13 am 
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This thread and title are funny. Fans are never satisfied.

We bitch for years about getting quality corners. Years. Bitch about It. Now we have one, that was drafted, even.

And we’re bitching about his tackling. Now that’s funny.


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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Sat Nov 04, 2017 7:58 am 
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Oh, I am quite happy and extremely satisfied with Mike Hilton and Joe Haden, Burns on the other hand...

...I mean you can't not appreciate the irony. We find an UDFA cut by two teams and sign a free agent from a division rival after he was cut and they are both playing better and more consistently than our first rounder we drafted.

If you had to choose one CB to do without from the trio of Burns, Haden and Hilton, Burns is the the obvious choice for me. That is kind of sad.

I am tired of excuses too. Screw his age, he is at the midway point of his second season, how much slack is he allowed?

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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Sat Nov 04, 2017 8:47 am 
Im still in wait and see mode. Defense is a team sport. So far theyve been pretty good.

I think there are 4 stats that make or break a defense.
The most important being TDs allowed and then some order of TFLs TOs and some metric of 1st downs/3rd and 4th conversions (?)

I think the D has been pretty good not allowing TDs.

If the offense pulls it together just a little things are gonna be fine


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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Sat Nov 04, 2017 10:27 am 
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Burns has been fine. For years, we complain that the Steelers prioritize CBs run defense prowess over pass defense. Now, we are bitching the corner doesn't play the run well enough? BS.

Burns has been beat a few times the last few weeks. I've also seen him making some nice closing plays throughout the year. He hasn't made the leap I'd hope but he is playing fine. There is some strong recency bias going on here.


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 Post subject: Re: Artie "Wiffs" Burns
PostPosted: Sat Nov 04, 2017 11:08 am 
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Zeke5123 wrote:
Burns has been fine. For years, we complain that the Steelers prioritize CBs run defense prowess over pass defense. Now, we are bitching the corner doesn't play the run well enough? BS.

Burns has been beat a few times the last few weeks. I've also seen him making some nice closing plays throughout the year. He hasn't made the leap I'd hope but he is playing fine. There is some strong recency bias going on here.

I ask: did you look at the stats I posted above and still think he's doing okay?

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