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 Post subject: Re: Ohio St. should be out of the playoff
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 1:35 pm 
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Ice wrote:
Nick79 wrote:
Ice wrote:
I kind of like that the outcome isn't predetermined.

The thing is, you're evaluating a bunch of 18-22 year old kids, for the most part. They can quite literally grow up and change as a season goes on. They play in different conferences, in different parts of the country, and even if they're playing common opponents, they're playing them at different times in their own respective seasons. It just really isn't possible to take subjective evaluation out of the equation.

If you can't handle that, may I humbly suggest that you stick to professional football.


I pretty much do not watch the beauty contest playoffs of CFB, I want college football to change to a logical system like all the NORMAL SPORTS have so that I can be interested in it. I like the way the division and conference winners qualify in the NORMAL SPORTS, even if they aren't the BEST TEAMS, put's pressure on the best teams to win their leagues.


I think it's nice that not all sports fit the same cookie-cutter mold, first off. Second off, like I said, there's subjectivity built into CFB. There has to be. It isn't a 30-32 team league, like all other "normal sports," with normative mechanisms like scheduling difficulty inverse to previous season's record and common drafts to insure a nice, orderly pecking order. Some years, some conferences are up, some years, other conferences are down; some years, one team's nonconference strength of schedule just doesn't measure up (whether it's through any fault of their own, or just the natural variance teams go through), some years the bad loss happens at the right time, and sometimes, it just doesn't always make perfect, empirical sense. If you can't embrace a little chaos, like I said, perhaps this just isn't the sport for you.


You're right, it isn't the sport for me as it stands, you see it as chaos, I see it as entrenched entitlement. I don't think it would be too much to ask to have all of the Power 5 champions qualify, you'd still have 3 spots for corporate welfare to bring in the blue blood teams that you feel bad for, who are supposed to be the BEST, but where FAILURES in actual games and didn't win their league.

I pretty much watch every Pitt Panthers game, and pretty much no other games, so I do have an interest. My issue is, if Pitt ever goes and wins an ACC title game some day, I'd like that ALONE to qualify them to be crushed by 'Bama in a playoff, that's part of why I want automatic qualifiers :lol:

And besides, what difference does it make if conferences are up or down? The thing some people don't get is that being CHAMPION has nothing to do with being BEST TEAM, so maybe a weak conference champ comes in, pulls an upset and runs the table and knocks off the top 3 seeds, like the Steelers did in '05, I see that is the essence of sports, not the BEST team winning every time.


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 Post subject: Re: Ohio St. should be out of the playoff
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 1:42 pm 
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superk wrote:
Nick, do you watch/play golf?


I did play golf for about 20-25 years, kind of gave up on it the last 3-4 years. And funny how as soon as I wasn't playing regularly, I lost interest in watching it about the same time, so what's your point? I can't imagine any comparison with golf and football?


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 Post subject: Re: Ohio St. should be out of the playoff
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 2:41 pm 
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Golf is my favorite sport, not just because I play and my daughters play, but largely because of the objectivity.

There is no hype in golf. You are as good as your scores. period. Pros get paid (rare exception of appearance fee for lesser tournaments for only the big names) based on performance. No make cut, no make paycheck. Just you. Rules pretty much Crystal clear with rare exception (DJs penalty at Oakmont this year was nonsense in addition to against the laws of physics, fortunately he still won).

I figured you'd like it as well based on your views on football....


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 Post subject: Re: Ohio St. should be out of the playoff
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 2:59 pm 
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superk wrote:
Golf is my favorite sport, not just because I play and my daughters play, but largely because of the objectivity.

There is no hype in golf. You are as good as your scores. period. Pros get paid (rare exception of appearance fee for lesser tournaments for only the big names) based on performance. No make cut, no make paycheck. Just you. Rules pretty much Crystal clear with rare exception (DJs penalty at Oakmont this year was nonsense in addition to against the laws of physics, fortunately he still won).

I figured you'd like it as well based on your views on football....


Exactly true. I do like golf, kind of just gotten out of it the last few years. But they do have some sponsors exemptions for the name guys who haven't performed and lost their card or something like that? Right?

Here's my thing about the college football playoff, If a team is so great, why shouldn't we demand they win? I really hate when a top team is upset in week 10 or 11 and the talking heads go into overdrive beginning the propaganda to have the LOSERS get a 2nd chance over the teams that beat them. Maybe it's just me, but I'd rather have a lesser team advance, than give corporate welfare to a rich guy who had all the advantages that went bankrupt.

Part of that is that I don't think Champion and Best is always the same. For a long time Tiger was best golfer, but there where always a bunch of nameless, faceless, nobodies, who own MAJOR CHAMPIONSHIPS because that one day, they rose up and did it, and I don't find that disappointing that the BEST was beaten.


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 Post subject: Re: Ohio St. should be out of the playoff
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 3:07 pm 
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So Western Michigan should be in the championship?

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 Post subject: Re: Ohio St. should be out of the playoff
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 3:55 pm 
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Western Michigan should be in their respective places of worship, praying Wisconsin gets the date wrong and doesn't show up.....


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 Post subject: Re: Ohio St. should be out of the playoff
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 3:58 pm 
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I can appreciate what you're saying about the Steelers' Super Bowl run of 2005 (and, while we're at it, the Pens' runs in 2009 and 2016). It's part of the beauty of what you've been referring to as "normal" (I would probably just say professional) sports. That underdog story is possible, as they're sports of peaks and valleys, played against pretty level competition; as most leagues have a certain amount of parity built in (baseball excluded, here).

College, at least as I've always seen it, just has a different set of parameters. You had better bring your A game every single week, because any old loss (even to Pitt, who certainly had a part to play this year; without their wins over Clemson and PSU, the playoff would look decidedly different), in any old week, can be the thing that keeps you out. Western Michigan? You can go undefeated, but unless you schedule a Michigan or MSU, or Ohio State (or Pitt) out of conference, we're never going to know. Every choice in scheduling is meaningful, every quarter of every single game is potentially meaningful. Your team could get screwed. There is a human element. You have to sweat out a decision by a relatively anonymous group, literally referred to as The Committee. Everything has to fall together perfectly, and then, maybe, you get a chance. There is no easy (or complicated, really) math that determines who is the best team. Or even the best four; and believe me, if they went to eight, there'd still be three or four schools a year with legitimate gripes. It really is trying to make order out of chaos. I guess it's just a different kind of compelling.


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 Post subject: Re: Ohio St. should be out of the playoff
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 4:02 pm 
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superk wrote:
Western Michigan should be in their respective places of worship, praying Wisconsin gets the date wrong and doesn't show up.....


but they are undefeated and won their conference championship....Unless it is not being chosen on the field.


I personally do not mind the current system. Although I feel that Washington got rewarded for playing a soft non-conference schedule which will lead to teams not scheduling tough opponents ( think Ohio state vs Oklahoma). i would not add any more slots as it leads to bracket inflation.

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 Post subject: Re: Ohio St. should be out of the playoff
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 4:15 pm 
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agree. plus they can't play more games. these guys are finished physically at this time and the NFL bound are starting combine prep (need to look good in shorts doing shuttle run and burpees so you catch Tomlin's eye)

College is just different. NFL is a single winner. Anything less is a losa in draft position. College has many winners. division, rivalry, conference, bowl, and the Natty. college football is dialed in right now....


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 Post subject: Re: Ohio St. should be out of the playoff
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 4:32 pm 
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Ice wrote:
Everything has to fall together perfectly, and then, maybe, you get a chance. There is no easy (or complicated, really) math that determines who is the best team. Or even the best four; and believe me, if they went to eight, there'd still be three or four schools a year with legitimate gripes. It really is trying to make order out of chaos. I guess it's just a different kind of compelling.


I think the 8 teams with 3 at large bids is where it needs to end up. I would even accept 6 teams with the top 2 teams getting a first week bye. Getting the 5 conference champs in is better for the game nation wide. I don't make the rules so I will just be happy watching the games as they are dished up to me.


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