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 Post subject: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating up
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2016 2:29 pm 
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http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2016/12/n ... tchen.html

I don't know much about the players we'd get from the Nats being mentioned in the article I just linked, but the scuttlebutt is we almost pulled the trigger on Cutch going to the Nats last year with Victor Robles (mentioned in the article) being part of that deal.

And the Bucs are apparently looking for (their favorite word) controllable starting pitching and a mix of prospects or ML-ready players.

Stay tuned...Nats apparently would like to complete any deal before tomorrow's contract-tender deadline because landing Cutch would shuffle their existing lineup and leave no room for Danny Espinoza, who they would then not tender an offer to.

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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2016 4:45 pm 
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Ah yes...one team striving to win a championship...one team looking to make/save money.
Beat em Bucs...hoka hey...and all that shit! :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2016 5:39 pm 
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Why would I buy season tickets? Let's get Melancon back.


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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2016 6:44 pm 
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Joe Ross is a good young pitcher. If the Bucs got Ross and Robles that would not be a bad return.

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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2016 7:30 pm 
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NH cannot make a deal for 22 that doesn't include a viable veteran starter for immediate inclusion into the rotation in 2017.


Get it done ;)


This is the right move on dealing 22 now while the return can be had and the outfield can again be a defensive weapon with Polanco in LF and Marte in CF with Bell's bat playing everyday in RF.


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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2016 8:48 pm 
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hopalong wrote:
Why would I buy season tickets? Let's get Melancon back.



Yes, Cutch for Melancon and 2 players to be named. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2016 9:35 pm 
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ironzabo wrote:
NH cannot make a deal for 22 that doesn't include a viable veteran starter for immediate inclusion into the rotation in 2017.


Get it done ;)


This is the right move on dealing 22 now while the return can be had and the outfield can again be a defensive weapon with Polanco in LF and Marte in CF with Bell's bat playing everyday in RF.

sadly I agree..id miss cutch but if the cards are played correctly the bucs could improve...


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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2016 11:58 pm 
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Greetings Gents. Let's pretend this deal isn't the fire sale that we know it is because "the standard is and continues to be the standard." It's been said that whenever a trade involves a superstar for multiple players that the team getting the superstar has the advantage -- known commodity vs. unknown commodities. Sometimes it works the other way -- hopefully that will prove to be the case here, but really why would DC need to part with anything significant knowing NH just wants to dump more payroll? Do you really think NH will say no if DC offers a ridiculous package (you know, like the Jays offered for Frankie last July)? NH is more interested in the principal going into the Nut's wallet than the principal of the thing.

My hope here is that the DC GM owes NH a favor, or that the DC GM will do NH a favor today for 15 tomorrow. That would translate into NH getting multiple players lauded by multiple experts allowing NH to take this to the fans still willing/ready/able to grow the Nut's wallet. YOC + Bell here + Meadows on the way = Championship in the next 5 years. Just think of it -- the Pirates have become the Montreal Expos of the 1990s, the team that migrated to DC to become the legit contender the Pirates keep promising Pirate fans is on the way (soon and very soon you know).

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Last edited by Bling Collector Ben on Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 8:54 am 
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This was part of the plan the whole time. Maybe not this soon, but this was part of the plan. The Pirates had a window, they got close but they didn't get it done, and now they start over. Hope like hell G Cole can turn it around, because his day is coming soon.

Welcome to being a fan of a small market team, in a rich team poor team league, trying to win in a no-cap league with an owner who will not deficit spend.....say it all together................The most fucked up sport in the history of professional sports.


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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 9:14 am 
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I disagree with Bling.

If the Pirates trade Cutch, they have to do it right. They have to get real talent in return.

The fans have been patient, but if this looks like a fire sale, they'll stop coming.

So we have to get real talent that everybody agrees is real talent back in return.

I think even Nutting and Neal understand that.

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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 1:20 am 
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Jeemie wrote:
I disagree with Bling.
If the Pirates trade Cutch, they have to do it right. They have to get real talent in return.
The fans have been patient, but if this looks like a fire sale, they'll stop coming.
So we have to get real talent that everybody agrees is real talent back in return.
I think even Nutting and Neal understand that.


Nutting and NH understand many things.
1. They have a right to trade Cutch.
2. They have a right to separate money from patient fans willing to continue parting with it for fireworks, $35 glutton fests, pirogi races, free tee shirts, etc. Enough of those still remain because their kids will nag the parents who will relent just like my parents relented when I nagged them back in the day (you know, when high quality baseball was its own drawing card).
3. Do it right. Does that mean doing their patient fans right? Or, does it mean doing right by their patient fans? I'm going way out on the limb here -- By March after hearing from local media apologists how the Bucs pulled the great train robbery by ditching a faltering Cutch those patient fans will once again believe the story instead of their lying eyeballs.
4. Even if people stop coming, the Nut and NH have already run numerous spreadsheet simulations and understand that they can clear as much or more on the cheap as paying more money for quality players to attract more fans. Know how I know that -- because Nutting won't sell the team even though he cries poor mouth every chance he gets. Dude should just sell the team if he can't get by on whatever he clears (but he doesn't)...why do you suppose that is?

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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 10:36 am 
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Nats apparently moving on to concentrate on Sale rather than McCutchen.

http://www.si.com/mlb/2016/12/05/winter ... chris-sale

But isn't this the classic line to set us up to accept it if Neal accepts an underwhelming offer for Cutch?

Quote:
Pittsburgh reportedly wants a high price for McCutchen, with the Pittsburgh Tribune’s Rob Bieftempfel reporting that the team asked for top prospects Lucas Giolito and Victor Robles from Washington in a potential trade. The Nationals said no, but it’s clear that the Pirates won’t let McCutchen go for nothing.


Of course, earlier in the article, we read this:

Quote:
The buzz around Winter Meetings has been that both players are on the block, with the Pirates and White Sox each motivated to move their superstars.


It's a sign of how bad it is that I immediately think Neal's setting us up. I can almost hear the line now if a deal is made, and the package is shit. "We worked our asses off for this deal...took all the way to the end of the winter meetings to get it done. Now let me tell you why these no-name pieces of shit are better than Robles, Ross, and Lopez or Giolito...we laughed at that offer when we found out we could get THESE guys".

So yes- I'm coming around to Bling's way of thinking.

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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 11:26 am 
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At this point they may as well keep him and move him to LF and put Marte in CF, and just allow him to leave after his contract runs out, and pray he returns close to his old self. I know the return for him won't even be worth making a trade.


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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 12:08 pm 
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Luca Brasi wrote:
At this point they may as well keep him and move him to LF and put Marte in CF, and just allow him to leave after his contract runs out, and pray he returns close to his old self. I know the return for him won't even be worth making a trade.


Yes- if the Nats are balking at offering up guys like Robles and Ross, who are the minimum of what I would feel is acceptable...who out there would be offering more?

And the Nats are probably saving those guys to offer for Chris Sale...which makes way more sense- give up top prospects for pitching above all else.

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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 4:25 pm 
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ESPN reporting Sale to the Red Sox.

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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 5:10 pm 
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Jobus Rum wrote:
ESPN reporting Sale to the Red Sox.


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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 5:19 pm 
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JackLambert58 wrote:
Jobus Rum wrote:
ESPN reporting Sale to the Red Sox.


Image


White Sox were looking for prospects and MLB-ready players for Sale.

What prospects would you have given up to get him?

His contract was totally reasonable though. Cutch-like for a pitcher.

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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 5:39 pm 
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Jeemie wrote:
JackLambert58 wrote:
Jobus Rum wrote:
ESPN reporting Sale to the Red Sox.


Image


White Sox were looking for prospects and MLB-ready players for Sale.

What prospects would you have given up to get him?

His contract was totally reasonable though. Cutch-like for a pitcher.


If they're keeping Cutch I would give them Meadows, Brault and you as a hall monitor to be named later.


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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2016 7:36 am 
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This guy made me laugh.

http://rumbunter.com/2016/12/06/pittsbu ... mccutchen/

Quote:
Much to the Pittsburgh Pirates fan delight no deal ever occurred between the Nationals and White Sox. Instead, the Boston Red Sox made the splash move and acquired the top left-handed talent. Immediately Pittsburgh Pirate fans rejoiced with that thought that the Bucs could get some of this young talent after all from the Nationals.


Much to Pirates' fans delight?!?!?!?

Does this guy think the fan base is greeting the potentially imminent trade of the face of the team with glee? Or that they trust Neal to get a proper return?

Maybe Neal wrote that paragraph.

Jesus!

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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2016 6:56 pm 
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Wow- Nats just slapped Neal in the face.

They went and got Adam Eaton from the White Sox for a package (Giolito, Lopez, and Dunning) similar to what the Bucs were looking for for Cutch.

Edited...it appears it was because Neal insisted on Robles as part of the deal, and the Nats don't want to part with Robles.

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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2016 9:19 pm 
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man..adam eaton? he looks like [just a guy] to me. id much rather have cutch..


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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2016 7:56 am 
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All indications are Cutch won't be traded now, so now we will have this awkward time in Pittsburgh for the next year or so.

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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2016 7:58 am 
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bam morris wrote:
man..adam eaton? he looks like [just a guy] to me. id much rather have cutch..


5 YOC v 2 YOC.

Two years younger

Lower ceiling but more upside v a guy potentially at his ceiling?

However, that was a HUGE price to pay for Adam Eaton, who I agree has a ceiling of a little higher than JAG. The White Sox scored big with their Sale and Eaton trades.

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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2016 7:20 pm 
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Eaton is a real weapon in the field and his consistency and absolute hustle on a daily basis in the here and now is why he is National.



Giolito sucked ass in his time in the show in 2016 FYI - and his velocity is dropping like Tomlin's Gut toward the earth as we speak.


KUDOS to NH for holding his ground and not accepting the deal for 22 that didn't include Joe Ross or Gio along with Viktor Rubles.



Go get my man Jake Odorizzi from the Rays sooner than later and take the shot on Holland as well to firm up the rotation.



Alen Hanson can be a very nice weapon at the top of this lineup IMHO if you are so inclined to make a deal with the Dbacks for Shelby Miller that includes JHAY and Cervelli and their gross contracts (DUMP THEM IF AT ALL POSSIBLE)



Diaz is an immediate upgrade over the fraud that Cervelli is right now.


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 Post subject: Re: Talks between Bucs and Nats for Cutch apparently heating
PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2016 9:26 pm 
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I'd rather see Jack, Steve, and Jeff Hanson skating on the Penguins first line than watch Alen Hanson hit at the top of the Pirates batting order.

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