It is currently Fri Oct 20, 2017 6:28 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 106 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 7, 8, 9, 10, 11
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Prayers for the victims of Pulse
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 8:25 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2014 3:08 pm
Posts: 4823
Image

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Prayers for the victims of Pulse
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 8:59 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2014 11:54 pm
Posts: 1632
955876 wrote:
Not in a battleground state, already said CA so I know full well my presidential votes mean shit. Unfortunately.

It's the battleground states I'm concerned with. Assume for a moment that in a highly competitive battleground state that Hillary pulls 45%, Trump 40%, and Johnson picks up 15%.

Now take Johnson out of the equation. If 11% of Johnson's vote go to Trump with the remaining 4% going to Hillary, Trump wins the state 51% to 49%. So it absolutely does matter in those states that can go either way.

And I realize that could just as easily work against Trump as well in my scenario. However, I tend to think that people who support Hillary will do so regardless as they are already in her camp and that many who'd vote third party would do so because they wouldn't vote Hillary regardless but also don't care for Trump. So in the end I belive a third party candidate hurts the republican see much more than it would hurt the democrats side. And I'd think most political experts would agree with that as third party candidates have hurt the republicans more in the past by splitting the vote.


You are missing the point. I'm not saying Johnson can't have an impact on the election (though it is unclear who he will impact). The issue is whether your vote can have an impact. If you voted for Johnson instead of Trump, that would make a negligible change in what votes are received by Trump or Johnson, and thus will not affect the outcome as you described.

If, on the other non-logical hand, you think your vote has magical powers that enable it to shift a large amount of the electorate... I guess we found out who has been responsible for the shitty candidates of the last twenty years.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Prayers for the victims of Pulse
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:25 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 9:23 pm
Posts: 2491
Another dude I knew is dead, from this senseless act.

Neo Nazi's aren't affiliated with Hitler, they pledge allegiance to a cause. Same shit different day.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Prayers for the victims of Pulse
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:58 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 9:23 pm
Posts: 2491
955876 wrote:
Kodiak wrote:
955876 wrote:
1) The same could be said of those smart enough not to swallow the bullshit spewed by Obama or Hillary.


LMFAO.....You know nothing about me. You just assume someone thinking for themselves and having some actual knowledge is a libtard.

Truth is I never voted for Obama, and I will never vote for Hillary. I'm a Libertarian and voting Gary Johnson next election.

The Islamophobes are as bad as the ban all gun nuts.


That's actually comforting to hear. Although voting for Johnson is simply a vote for Hillary. So you might want to rethink that.

People are becoming "islamophobes" because Islam is waging a war against western culture at an ever increasing rate and our current "leaders" are doing nothing of substance to actually slow this train wreck down.

I assumed you might be a libtard because of the Trump comment as well as the lengths you are going through to dismiss this as anything but radical Islam.

I get he was a "lone wolf". I also get he was likely already a sick individual. My point is that he can be those things AND inspired by radical Islam. It doesn't have to be so black & white Kodiak. It's a complicated issue with many layers. Radical Islam could be but the final piece that allows sick individuals to finally lets just call it "cross the point of no return".

I'm sure you are aware that part of the sick plan is to push these lone wolves to do their bidding. You and I can both be correct on this. I'm not claiming to have a definitive answer as to why this tragedy took place. At this same time, it's quite frustrating to see someone who I'd consider a smart independent thinker (you) completely dismiss his connections to Islam...

And for the record, I don't care for Trump either and really really really wished a better candidate would have emerged. The republicans have had 4 years to mold a candidate and all they came up with was the same crap they always run up there. It's no wonder a guy like Trump emerged when looking at his competition.

I had higher hopes for Carson but he lacked a certain dynamic to get further.

I really have no interest in getting in a pissing match about this. I try to look at things from all sides. I don't feel you are doing the same by dismissing this as purely 100% "lone wolf"... It's far to complicated an issues to simply come down to an either or situation.



Everyone needs to calm down...including myself. There's multiple layers to this thing & everyone has a fundamental need to place blame.

Sometimes you can't stop sick people from doing disgusting things.

Being extremist as a retaliation, is worse. And don't give me fight fire with fire...it's a homicidal argument.

Youre just enforcing the hate for the West...I'm not going into past shit because it doesn't matter. I want a plan to stop this nonsense, which none of us can provide on an internet forum.

Vote & write your congessman.

& thank you '98, I'm at a plus 1 dead at this juncture. People don't give a shit about that...

_________________
Image


Last edited by VanWilder on Thu Jun 16, 2016 11:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Prayers for the victims of Pulse
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 11:06 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 8:12 pm
Posts: 3258
Zeke5123 wrote:
955876 wrote:
Not in a battleground state, already said CA so I know full well my presidential votes mean shit. Unfortunately.

It's the battleground states I'm concerned with. Assume for a moment that in a highly competitive battleground state that Hillary pulls 45%, Trump 40%, and Johnson picks up 15%.

Now take Johnson out of the equation. If 11% of Johnson's vote go to Trump with the remaining 4% going to Hillary, Trump wins the state 51% to 49%. So it absolutely does matter in those states that can go either way.

And I realize that could just as easily work against Trump as well in my scenario. However, I tend to think that people who support Hillary will do so regardless as they are already in her camp and that many who'd vote third party would do so because they wouldn't vote Hillary regardless but also don't care for Trump. So in the end I belive a third party candidate hurts the republican see much more than it would hurt the democrats side. And I'd think most political experts would agree with that as third party candidates have hurt the republicans more in the past by splitting the vote.


You are missing the point. I'm not saying Johnson can't have an impact on the election (though it is unclear who he will impact). The issue is whether your vote can have an impact. If you voted for Johnson instead of Trump, that would make a negligible change in what votes are received by Trump or Johnson, and thus will not affect the outcome as you described.

If, on the other non-logical hand, you think your vote has magical powers that enable it to shift a large amount of the electorate... I guess we found out who has been responsible for the shitty candidates of the last twenty years.


I actually think it's you missing the point. By a lot actually. Who ever reduced this down to one vote? Not me. I'm discussing he impact the third party candidate will have on an election. This cannot be disputed. Keep trying if you must.

I never implied nor would I think my singular vote would make a difference. Duh. Seriously dude why even go there? Do you really think I think 1 vote makes a difference?

Now if you add a 3rd candidate to the ballot and let's say in a battleground state that candidate garners 100,000, 200,000, 250,000 votes etc (whatever the number is) that end up equating to let's say 5-15% of the total votes that can ABSOLUTELY impact the election. How can you possible say otherwise?

A third party candidate pulling say 12% of votes could absolutely make a difference in what happens to the other two. That's 12% that could have gone either way. A huge difference.

How can that possibly not matter?

I think all this time you are spending in an attempt to educate me on the electoral college (which I'm aware of how it works so you've said nothing of merit) has caused you to overlook simple math.

A third party candidate can't win. However, they can absolutely help determine which of the other two win/lose based on how that segment of voter might have voted otherwise. Political strategist would absolutely agree with me.

From the 2000 election:

— Many say third-party candidate Ralph Nader played a “spoiler” role in the 2000 election. Running to the left of Democrat Al Gore, Nader received 97,488 popular votes in Florida, a state Republican George W. Bush won by just 537 votes. If most of the Nader supporters had voted for Gore instead, Gore would have won Florida’s 25 electoral votes, and he would have been elected president instead of Bush.

Please stop while you are behind.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Prayers for the victims of Pulse
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2016 6:07 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2014 11:54 pm
Posts: 1632
Earlier, you stated that a vote for Johnson is a vote for Hillary (assuming that Johnson only pulls support from Trump which isnt clearly the case). When I pointed out that of course this isn't true and that you should vote your conscience, you withdrew to the point that 3rd party candidates can have an impact on an election. But of course that's an ineffective defense of my argument. Hopefully, you see that.

I'd also note that you seem to be Republican. It once was a third party. Thus, while it is unlikely that a third party can win, it isn't impossible. U.K. IP is a more recent example in another first past the post system.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 106 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 7, 8, 9, 10, 11

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
FORUM RULES --- PRIVACY POLICY




Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group