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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:13 am 
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COR-TEN wrote:
blu wrote:
no thanks to Donald Trump for exacerbating the issue.
This is exactly what he wanted. He wants to control the national discourse, yet again, and the media follows him around like a puppy. It distracts from his ineptness, shenanigans, and idiocy. No natural disasters available, so. . .


This is what I said in another thread.

Donald Trump likes to fuck with people, and they keep letting him.

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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:15 am 
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Jeemie wrote:
COR-TEN wrote:
blu wrote:
no thanks to Donald Trump for exacerbating the issue.
This is exactly what he wanted. He wants to control the national discourse, yet again, and the media follows him around like a puppy. It distracts from his ineptness, shenanigans, and idiocy. No natural disasters available, so. . .


This is what I said in another thread.

Donald Trump likes to fuck with people, and they keep letting him.




not sure hes smart enough to execute this. He is easily in the running for stupidest/ most ignorant fuck on this planet. JMO


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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:17 am 
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If something doesn't make me money or make me happy, I move on.

Went to a game yesterday it wasn't fun even though I didn't pay. I wouldn't go again even with another free ticket.

As Seinfeld says, it's all rooting for laundry.

I am done with the NFL. Inferior entertainment product to college football in every way except talent level of players.

For all of you who believe that the NFL was just allowing freedom of expression, let me remind you of this:

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/09 ... et-decall/

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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:30 am 
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Dan Smith--BYU wrote:
If something doesn't make me money or make me happy, I move on.

Went to a game yesterday it wasn't fun even though I didn't pay. I wouldn't go again even with another free ticket.

As Seinfeld says, it's all rooting for laundry.

I am done with the NFL. Inferior entertainment product to college football in every way except talent level of players.

For all of you who believe that the NFL was just allowing freedom of expression, let me remind you of this:

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/09 ... et-decall/


I could not have said it better myself. I have been a fan over 40 years and I am steadily reaching the point of not giving a fuck. The product on the field is shitty and it isn't worth being in a bad mood about it.

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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:32 am 
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If the Steeler players voted to stay inside for the national anthem & the majority ruled then Villanueva could have stood to attention inside & not make it seem that other players are not patriotic. The kneeling at the anthem was never an issue about loyalty to the flag but a free speech condemnation of a society where African-American men may more readily be shot/killed.


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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:40 am 
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GreekSteel wrote:
not sure hes smart enough to execute this. He is easily in the running for stupidest/ most ignorant fuck on this planet. JMO


You underestimate his intuitive understanding of what makes people tick at your peril.

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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:49 am 
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Nick79 wrote:
...Why does it have to saturate every sports event, especially constantly throughout every single NFL game from beginning to end? It has nothing to do with FOOTBALL, and they ram it down our throats and act like you can't play a game without it?

I wish they'd stop playing the anthem at games, and stop with all the bullshit military displays every 10 minutes! It's a sport, it doesn't need any politics or patriotism, how about we stop dragging soldiers out on the field every 10 minutes to recognize them, let's send out some teachers or paramedics or social workers that HELP PEOPLE sometimes too along with some soldiers? How about ENTIRE GAMES where we don't mention "the flag", "the troops" etc. none of that has a damn thing to do with football, The main reason for the military overkill is the Defense Department PAID FOR IT. .



Always follow the money. The Dept of Defense and National Guard started paying the NFL in 2009 to show the anthem before games to conjure up more patriotism in the country. Before that it wasn't televised like it is now. Keep people happy and content while more of our freedoms are whittled away and the government spies on its citizens. But I love my football team and that flag sure is pretty. 'Merica baby!


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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:52 am 
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SP wrote:
Nick79 wrote:
...Why does it have to saturate every sports event, especially constantly throughout every single NFL game from beginning to end? It has nothing to do with FOOTBALL, and they ram it down our throats and act like you can't play a game without it?

I wish they'd stop playing the anthem at games, and stop with all the bullshit military displays every 10 minutes! It's a sport, it doesn't need any politics or patriotism, how about we stop dragging soldiers out on the field every 10 minutes to recognize them, let's send out some teachers or paramedics or social workers that HELP PEOPLE sometimes too along with some soldiers? How about ENTIRE GAMES where we don't mention "the flag", "the troops" etc. none of that has a damn thing to do with football, The main reason for the military overkill is the Defense Department PAID FOR IT. .



Always follow the money. The Dept of Defense and National Guard started paying the NFL in 2009 to show the anthem before games to conjure up more patriotism in the country. Before that it wasn't televised like it is now. Keep people happy and content while more of our freedoms are whittled away and the government spies on its citizens. But I love my football team and that flag sure is pretty. 'Merica baby!
Remember during the 7th inning stretch they played take me out to the ball game? After 911 it was replaced with god bless america. Haven't been to a game in years, but do they still do that?

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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:54 am 
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Jeemie wrote:
GreekSteel wrote:
not sure hes smart enough to execute this. He is easily in the running for stupidest/ most ignorant fuck on this planet. JMO


You underestimate his intuitive understanding of what makes people tick at your peril.





possibly and not to get into a major trump conversation, but again I highly doubt that


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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:55 am 
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W&M_Steeler wrote:
Miter Saw wrote:
Many of us took the bait on this nonsense.

Reactionary vs rational.

I for one no longer give a fuck and will laugh in anyone's face for even bringing it up.

Fuck your "movement". Fuck your hysteria against this "movement".

I got no time for your nonsense ...and i'll no longer take the bait just because I'm forcefed the idea that I should give a fuck.

Solidarity - whatever. It's a f'n decision to stand or kneel. and everyone's wigged out. Give me a break. More coverage on it than the games. Take your drama out of my sporting event. I'm ignoring it from now on anyway.

Moving on.......


Agreed. Great post.


You want sports without politics? Good luck with that because Sports and Politics have been tied together for 100s of years. This post also highlights people who just want to ignore the world around them. People who doing nothing when bigotry, racism and inequality are coming from the highest levels of our own Government....yeah the legacy of that type of behavior isn't good.


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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:57 am 
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COR-TEN wrote:
blu wrote:
no thanks to Donald Trump for exacerbating the issue.
This is exactly what he wanted. He wants to control the national discourse, yet again, and the media follows him around like a puppy. It distracts from his ineptness, shenanigans, and idiocy. No natural disasters available, so. . .


Actually there is a massive natural disaster happening to Americans right now in Puerto Rico.


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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:05 pm 
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steelclan wrote:
W&M_Steeler wrote:
Miter Saw wrote:
Many of us took the bait on this nonsense.

Reactionary vs rational.

I for one no longer give a fuck and will laugh in anyone's face for even bringing it up.

Fuck your "movement". Fuck your hysteria against this "movement".

I got no time for your nonsense ...and i'll no longer take the bait just because I'm forcefed the idea that I should give a fuck.

Solidarity - whatever. It's a f'n decision to stand or kneel. and everyone's wigged out. Give me a break. More coverage on it than the games. Take your drama out of my sporting event. I'm ignoring it from now on anyway.

Moving on.......


Agreed. Great post.


You want sports without politics? Good luck with that because Sports and Politics have been tied together for 100s of years. This post also highlights people who just want to ignore the world around them. People who doing nothing when bigotry, racism and inequality are coming from the highest levels of our own Government....yeah the legacy of that type of behavior isn't good.


I watch football for entertainment, not to receive political lectures from twenty-something year old football players. I don't care what they think, whether I fundamentally support their position or not. I simply don't look to NFL players, coaches, owners, or commentators for political discourse. There are far better sources. So, as a result, I couldn't care less about whether the players stand, sit, knee, etc.


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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:05 pm 
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steelclan wrote:
COR-TEN wrote:
blu wrote:
no thanks to Donald Trump for exacerbating the issue.
This is exactly what he wanted. He wants to control the national discourse, yet again, and the media follows him around like a puppy. It distracts from his ineptness, shenanigans, and idiocy. No natural disasters available, so. . .


Actually there is a massive natural disaster happening to Americans right now in Puerto Rico.
I'm guessing he doesn't give a shit about what happens in PR.

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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:12 pm 
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COR-TEN wrote:
Remember during the 7th inning stretch they played take me out to the ball game? After 911 it was replaced with god bless america. Haven't been to a game in years, but do they still do that?

Only on Sundays

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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:16 pm 
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One aspect of this that changes everything -- Since 2009, the United States Department of Defense has paid the NFL to stage on-field patriotic ceremonies. As such, this is no longer a matter of a private employer simply forcing an employee to conform with a company policy, i.e., stand for the national anthem. The NFL could be considered a "state actor" because it is performing a governmental function (promoting patriotism) that is endorsed and funded by the federal government. As a "state actor," the NFL is therefore subject to regulation under the Bill of Rights -- in this case, First Amendment protections of freedom of speech and expression. The NFL likely knows this, and that's why they haven't enacted policies prohibiting kneeling, raised fists, etc., or simply fired the "sons of bitches" who engage in protected speech. Political speech is among the most highly protected forms of speech and the NFL would want no part of the ensuing lawsuits if they were to prohibit peaceful, political demonstrations.

I'm not using this post to argue one way or another about the rightness/wrongness of the protests, just providing some food for thought. Many have argued that the NFL is a wholly private corporation and can simply force its players to stand for the anthem or subject them to discipline. Given the government's entanglement with the NFL to promote patriotism, I don't think it's as simple as that anymore.


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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:18 pm 
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North Korea forces you to worship their flag...their government....their military...their thinking. You must be patriot.

Those communist fuckers in the USSR forced you as well. So did those old British kings of whom we found intolerable.

It is Orwellian. Remember in 1984...if you didn't scream loud enough praising Big Brother and country, you were an enemy. And enemy to be locked up. An enemy to be tortured.

You guys all KNOW this.

I'm debating whether to go to another Chicago Blackhawks game. Every game...EVERY fucking game...for well over a decade....they trudge out 2-3 vets and we have to cheer for them. We don't HAVE too...but people get up like robots and start screaming as if they were Dan Daly.

I love our military. But since 9/11, they've become a cult to be worshipped instead of a branch of government with a shitload of money and support from their citizens.

Why not praise a teacher at these games? A charity group? Some young kids who did something nice for school or community? ER docs? Pediatric oncology nurses?

Why not a fireman? A police officer? A scientist who discovered something wonderful? People who run the local food banks or shelters?

Why are they shoving the military down my throat? There's more to the United States than boots and rifles.

We are Athens, not Sparta. Athens became the basis of western knowledge and secularism whose influence is fundamental to civilization to this day. Sparta became a comic book turned into an onscreen graphic novel (albeit a kickass one).

Sporting events are turning into a Spartan comic book...BAM!!! KABOOM!!! VICTORY!!!

p.s. Throughout history, the Athenian navy was just as crucial and heroic in defending Greece from the Persians as the Spartan heavy infantry. Don't say without Sparta, Athens doesn't exist. Without Athens, Sparta doesn't exist. They both were crucial. The Spartans just looked really badass without shirts.

9/11 fucked us in the head good gentlemen. No matter what happens, they won a victory for they changed us that day...and I cannot say for the better.

I want my football back.

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Last edited by ChicagoSteel on Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:20 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:19 pm 
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The NFL could have snipped this in the bud and said "Back to 2009. No teams on the field for the Anthem." Stops all this foolish crap that has nothing to do with the game

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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:20 pm 
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blu wrote:
It's unfortunate that the divisiveness of America has entered sport through the kneeling at the anthem/flag. But perhaps it's due. Regardless, no thanks to Donald Trump for exacerbating the issue. I hope players don't come out for the anthem like before. The Steelers did the right thing.


It entered the sport when the Defense Department paid the NFL for weekly military displays and celebrations at every game.


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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:22 pm 
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Pabst wrote:
I can't wait for the next time a team requests taxpayer funding for a new stadium.


They shouldn't get taxpayer funding even if they stand with hand on heart through the whole thing, then get on their knees and service lady liberty.


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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:24 pm 
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.


Last edited by blu on Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:28 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:24 pm 
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I suppose I started this by mentioning how the president exacerbated the kneeling/flag issue but let's all end this now mentioning any or all thoughts of Donald Trump's presidency. It's not fair to the mods who may have to scour the posts deciding which ones to delete & which posters to warn about the no politics rule.
Many of us may have strong thoughts about Donald Trump pro & con but this is not the venue for it & it brings no benefit to mention it here. I'd delete my initial sentence but it's repeated in to several posts so instead I ask you all to let it go for now.


Last edited by blu on Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:27 pm 
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KCSteeler wrote:
This deal with the anthem is just another example of poor leadership. While you can make the case that the anthem doesn’t need to be played at sporting events, if it is being played, you stand, period. You are a fucking man playing a game for millions of dollars in this country. The fact that this team has an Army veteran on their team and cannot put stupid bullshit aside to stand for him says a lot. I have always loved the Steelers and have been proud to wear gear because it seemed like they stood for something, integrity at a minimum. Yesterday was an embarrassment on many levels.


You speak for the military? No you don't. I'm a retired Lt Col and I have zero issue with Black players taking a knee for gross injustice. I had zero qualms John Carlos & Tommie Smith. Zero issue with Jackie Robinson calling out racism when he was told to STFU.

You want some history on the military? How about 1919 Red Summer: Black troops came back from WW1 after going through sheer hell in trenches of Europe and came home to the welcome of lynchings, oppression and vile murderous acts.

In WW2 Black vets came back to Jim Crow. Same for Korean vets.

Japanese vets many members of the famous 442nd (most decorated Unit in WW2) came back to their friends and loved ones being in concentration camps.

Black troops returning from Iraq and Afghanistan have been shot down in the streets of their home towns by cops.

Taking a knee is a peaceful protest and we need to stop making out the anthem as some sacrosanct, untouchable thing especially considering our horrific History with race.

Imagine if Fredrick Douglas had taken a knee in 1860 and someone had screamed at him to stand for the anthem. The anthem that at that point celebrated a nation where there was close to 4 million slaves.

Imagine if a Black civil war vet had taken a knee in 1870s Louisiana to protest and someone screamed at him to stand for the anthem. The same anthem that celebrated a nation that did nothing about Colfax Massacre, murder, rape, lynchings that dominated reconstruction. Instead this nation stood aside & allowed bigots in the South to prevent Americans from voting, earning a good living, holding any position of power and lynching anyone who dared show any resistance.

WW1: imagine Black people took a knee and people screamed at them to stand up for the anthem. An anthem that celebrated a nation where A President watched the height of racism and hate in movies: Birth of a Nation in the damn white house. That movie and virulent white supremacy led to the Red Summer 2nd coming of KKK and thousands of cheap statues of bigoted confederate Generals showing up all over the country.

WW2 & Korea: imagine Black people took a knee and people screamed at them to stand up for the anthem. An anthem that celebrated a nation with mass segregation & Jim Crow for Black vets to return to.

Vietnam: imagine Black people took a knee and people screamed at them to stand up for the anthem. An anthem that celebrated a nation that sent Black troops to Vietnam in massively higher proportions to a War that should never have been fought in the first place.

Iraq/Afghanistan: imagine if Black athletes or Black people took a knee and people screamed at them to stand up for the anthem. An anthem that celebrated a nation were Vets returning from War got gunned down in their own neighborhoods.

If you refuse to deal with America's history of race then screaming about someone taking a knee in protest during national anthem is based on ignorance.

You have a choice you can learn and know why people protest and why it is at core of what makes this nation better or try to ignore the litany of flaws this nation has and act like any protest against what it currently is and has been hurts your fi fis.

This nation was founded by 50% slave owners start there and then maybe you can understand why without protest the national anthem would still be celebrating a nation with millions of slaves.


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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:34 pm 
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steelclan wrote:
KCSteeler wrote:
This deal with the anthem is just another example of poor leadership. While you can make the case that the anthem doesn’t need to be played at sporting events, if it is being played, you stand, period. You are a fucking man playing a game for millions of dollars in this country. The fact that this team has an Army veteran on their team and cannot put stupid bullshit aside to stand for him says a lot. I have always loved the Steelers and have been proud to wear gear because it seemed like they stood for something, integrity at a minimum. Yesterday was an embarrassment on many levels.


You speak for the military? No you don't. I'm a retired Lt Col and I have zero issue with Black players taking a knee for gross injustice. I had zero qualms John Carlos & Tommie Smith. Zero issue with Jackie Robinson calling out racism when he was told to STFU.

You want some history on the military? How about 1919 Red Summer: Black troops came back from WW1 after going through sheer hell in trenches of Europe and came home to the welcome of lynchings, oppression and vile murderous acts.

In WW2 Black vets came back to Jim Crow. Same for Korean vets.

Japanese vets many of members of the famous 442nd (most decorated Unit in WW2) to their friends and loved ones being in concentration camps.

Black troops returning from Iraq and Afghanistan have been shot down in the streets of their home towns by cops.

Taking a knee is a peaceful protest and we need to stop making out the anthem is some sacrosanct, untouchable thing especially considering our horrific History with race.

Imagine if Fredrick Douglas had taken a knee in 1860 and someone had screamed at him to stand for the anthem. The anthem that at that point celebrated a nation where the was close to 4 million slaves.

Imagine if a Black civil war vet had taken a knee in 1870s Louisiana to protest and someone screamed at him to stand for the anthem. The same anthem that of a nation that did nothing about Colfax Massacre, murder, rape, lynchings that dominated reconstruction and instead allowed bigots in the South to prevent Americans from voting, earning a good living, holding any position of power and lynching anyone who dared show any resistance.

WW1: imagine Black people took a knee and people screamed at them to stand up for the anthem. An anthem that celebrated a nation where A President watched the height of racism and hate in movies: Birth of a Nation in the damn white house. That movie and virulent white supremacy led to the Red Summer and thousands of cheap statues of bigoted confederate Generals showing up all over the country.

WW2 & Korea: imagine Black people took a knee and people screamed at them to stand up for the anthem. An anthem that celebrated a nation with mass segregation & Jim Crow for Black vets to return to.

Vietnam: imagine Black people took a knee and people screamed at them to stand up for the anthem. An anthem that celebrated a nation that sent Black troops to Vietnam is massively higher proportions to a War that should never have been fought in the first place.

Iraq/Afghanistan: imagine if Black athletes or Black people took a knee and people scream at them to stand up for the anthem. An anthem that celebrated a nation were Vets returning from War got gunned down in the own neighborhoods.

If you refuse to deal with America's history of race then screaming about someone taking a knee in protest in national anthem isn't based on ignorance.

You have a choice you can learn and know why people protest and why it is at core of what makes this nation better or try to ignore the litany of flaws this nation has and act like any protest against what it currently is and has been hurts your fi fis.

This nation was founded by 50% slave owners start there and then maybe you can understand why without protest the national anthem would still be celebrating a nation with millions of slaves.




Great post Clan.


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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:34 pm 
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ChicagoSteel wrote:
North Korea forces you to worship their flag...their government....their military...their thinking. You must be patriot.

Those communist fuckers in the USSR forced you as well. So did those old British kings of whom we found intolerable.

It is Orwellian. Remember in 1984...if you didn't scream loud enough praising Big Brother and country, you were an enemy. And enemy to be locked up. An enemy to be tortured.

You guys all KNOW this.

I'm debating whether to go to another Chicago Blackhawks game. Every game...EVERY fucking game...for well over a decade....they trudge out 2-3 vets and we have to cheer for them. We don't HAVE too...but people get up like robots and start screaming as if they were Dan Daly.

I love our military. But since 9/11, they've become a cult to be worshipped instead of a branch of government with a shitload of money and support from their citizens.

Why not praise a teacher at these games? A charity group? Some young kids who did something nice for school or community? ER docs? Pediatric oncology nurses?

Why not a fireman? A police officer? A scientist who discovered something wonderful? People who run the local food banks or shelters?

Why are they shoving the military down my throat? There's more to the United States than boots and rifles.

We are Athens, not Sparta. Athens became the basis of western knowledge and secularism whose influence is fundamental to civilization to this day. Sparta became a comic book turned into an onscreen graphic novel (albeit a kickass one).

Sporting events are turning into a Spartan comic book...BAM!!! KABOOM!!! VICTORY!!!

p.s. Throughout history, the Athenian navy was just as crucial and heroic in defending Greece from the Persians as the Spartan heavy infantry. Don't say without Sparta, Athens doesn't exist. Without Athens, Sparta doesn't exist. They both were crucial. The Spartans just looked really badass without shirts.

9/11 fucked us in the head good gentlemen. No matter what happens, they won a victory for they changed us that day...and I cannot say for the better.

I want my football back.
This

And this

steelclan wrote:
You speak for the military? No you don't. I'm a retired Lt Col and I have zero issue with Black players taking a knee for gross injustice. I had zero qualms John Carlos & Tommie Smith. Zero issue with Jackie Robinson calling out racism when he was told to STFU.

You want some history on the military? How about 1919 Red Summer: Black troops came back from WW1 after going through sheer hell in trenches of Europe and came home to the welcome of lynchings, oppression and vile murderous acts.

In WW2 Black vets came back to Jim Crow. Same for Korean vets.

Japanese vets many members of the famous 442nd (most decorated Unit in WW2) came back to their friends and loved ones being in concentration camps.

Black troops returning from Iraq and Afghanistan have been shot down in the streets of their home towns by cops.

Taking a knee is a peaceful protest and we need to stop making out the anthem as some sacrosanct, untouchable thing especially considering our horrific History with race.

Imagine if Fredrick Douglas had taken a knee in 1860 and someone had screamed at him to stand for the anthem. The anthem that at that point celebrated a nation where there was close to 4 million slaves.

Imagine if a Black civil war vet had taken a knee in 1870s Louisiana to protest and someone screamed at him to stand for the anthem. The same anthem that celebrated a nation that did nothing about Colfax Massacre, murder, rape, lynchings that dominated reconstruction. Instead this nation stood aside & allowed bigots in the South to prevent Americans from voting, earning a good living, holding any position of power and lynching anyone who dared show any resistance.

WW1: imagine Black people took a knee and people screamed at them to stand up for the anthem. An anthem that celebrated a nation where A President watched the height of racism and hate in movies: Birth of a Nation in the damn white house. That movie and virulent white supremacy led to the Red Summer 2nd coming of KKK and thousands of cheap statues of bigoted confederate Generals showing up all over the country.

WW2 & Korea: imagine Black people took a knee and people screamed at them to stand up for the anthem. An anthem that celebrated a nation with mass segregation & Jim Crow for Black vets to return to.

Vietnam: imagine Black people took a knee and people screamed at them to stand up for the anthem. An anthem that celebrated a nation that sent Black troops to Vietnam in massively higher proportions to a War that should never have been fought in the first place.

Iraq/Afghanistan: imagine if Black athletes or Black people took a knee and people screamed at them to stand up for the anthem. An anthem that celebrated a nation were Vets returning from War got gunned down in their own neighborhoods.

If you refuse to deal with America's history of race then screaming about someone taking a knee in protest during national anthem is based on ignorance.

You have a choice you can learn and know why people protest and why it is at core of what makes this nation better or try to ignore the litany of flaws this nation has and act like any protest against what it currently is and has been hurts your fi fis.

This nation was founded by 50% slave owners start there and then maybe you can understand why without protest the national anthem would still be celebrating a nation with millions of slaves.
It has been used as a political tool to divide and label the opposition. It has been blown out of proportion, but it reflects how some people think about race and race relations.

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 Post subject: Re: The Anthem/Patriotism/The Flag...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:37 pm 
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R S wrote:
when i was in college 99-2003 we said the lords prayer as a team before every game. I'm going out on a limb and saying that doesn't happen anymore. I imagine there would be massive protests if the student newspaper caught wind of that.

I know a prominent high school, in a community with many non Christians, that does the Lord's Prayer before every game.

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