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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 12:05 am 
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At one point it occurred to me that it seems like the same posters who come down hard on Tomlin are also posters who are coming out as conservatives in political discussions. What do you guys think? Are conservatives also more likely to want to fire Tomlin? Are liberals more likely to be tolerant of his mistakes?

In no way, shape or form am I talking about his race. I'm talking strictly about the personality traits of the posters. Are liberal posters more forgiving that conservatives?


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 8:16 am 
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By the way. Last night in Green Bay:

Attendance: 78,362
100%
Capacity: 72,928

"I'm done, no more NFL for me!" LOL.


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 8:21 am 
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dropemjaybird wrote:
Nick79 wrote:

But you obviously believe in that trickle down NONSENSE and I think that's just a scam for the rich to hoard even more of the pie.


Part owner of a small business - the 20% corp rate would most likely allow us to hire another person or give 3 of our young guys a raise.

You don't know what you are talking about.


Why isn't Kansas thriving in that trickle down paradise they created?
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions ... c733b007a6


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 9:23 am 
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Still Lit wrote:
955876, back to our earlier discussion about teacher pay.

I take it that you see that it is of no fault of kids in shitty school districts that their schools are shitty. And I take it that you see that early childhood education makes a gigantic difference for a person's attitude toward school and themselves.

And I take it you see that kids are not free loaders looking for handouts.

Two things I am in favor of. Massive redistribution of wealth to intervene in shitty districts and turn them around. You simply have to pay enough money to people competent to turn these places around. It is a giant cluster fuck. Inner city teachers, even shitty ones, are saints. The turn over rate is horrendous.

Universal access to free community college for TRADE skills (not college transfer classes, trade skills only) for those who cannot afford it.

We can end the need for handouts and dependence by giving the historically disadvantaged the same chance as others as children. Children who live in poverty and drug infested shit holes have so much working against them. The idea that the playing field is level is RISIBLE.

I will concede you everything you want about lazy adults if it will get you to agree to my point about education of the young.


GREAT post Lit. Kudos And with a better educated populace, one that can think CRITICALLY, you would have less instances of people voting against their best interests and then have a better chance of electing people who really want to help their voters instead of themselves (at the expense of the voter). BTW the USA rank's 7th on this list higher than I expected to be honest. Top 6 are socialist countries go figure.
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countr ... -full-list


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 10:46 am 
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NY State spends the most amount of money per student in the country. These are the results:

http://videos.news12.com/NYSFailingSchoolsReport.pdf

Here in Long Island we have a school district, Hempstead (97% Black and Hispanic..primarily low income), that spends 26,000 per year per student (more than nearby towns with million dollar homes). 26k! They are a failing district. Money isn't going to fix things. It's the family unit that has broken down. We keep thinking that more $$ tossed at the problem will lead to better education. It won't do any good until you stabilize families. How do you do that? Well, community leaders have to look in the mirror and take some responsibility first of all rather than just blaming others. Secondly, local political corruption has to be fixed. Killer taxes discouraging local investment are crushing the communities. Get the economy fixed, get people jobs, and you will start to see more families staying together. Better families mean the kids will be more motivated at school and results will improve.


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 10:57 am 
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franco32 wrote:
NY State spends the most amount of money per student in the country. These are the results:

http://videos.news12.com/NYSFailingSchoolsReport.pdf

Here in Long Island we have a school district, Hempstead (97% Black and Hispanic..primarily low income), that spends 26,000 per year per student (more than nearby towns with million dollar homes). 26k! They are a failing district. Money isn't going to fix things. It's the family unit that has broken down.


That's because the parents are fucked up and don't participate. And it's not even racial, it's socioeconomic. My daughter is going to a private school now, lots and lots of black kids there, all achieving academically. I've actually heard some of their parents ACTUALLY SAY, that they don't want to send their kids to a black school because there's no learning ethic. And even in schools that are at least half white, there is a trend toward the same thing and no teacher control because political correctness keeps teachers from being allowed to dispense serious discipline, like they do at the private schools. I was always a public school guy, but I just reached a breaking point, learning shit wasn't a priority at her public school, and they simply let fucked up stoners and assholes run wild, especially of certain races to avoid being labeled racist, political correctness keeping them from receiving the ugly, brutal beat downs they deserved.


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 11:21 am 
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Quote:
1) I think I remember you posting that you have a degree in Economics, so I'm sure you know more about Demand-side economics than I do and can answer your own question. Put more money in the hands of poor and middle class people, they go out and spend it thereby spurring business. Business owners make money, they hire more people to deal with the growing demand. Those people then take their new paychecks and buy stuff spurring the economy further.


And that argument has merit. Look, I'm not some hardcore trickle down only line in the sand guy. There are positives & negatives in both. Also, realize that when debating on a message board my opinion might come across as being rigid but part of that is the counter point I'm debating comes across as being rigid as well. You have your side, I have my side and it gets debated with neither realizing the answer lies somewhere in the middle. There have however been studies on where money is spent when you put it in the hands of the poor and the negligible impact it has on the broad economy. While they might be better off individually, someone else was made weaker to accomplish that. Big & long debates can be made over supply side vs demand side. I think a better (and easier for debate purposes here) example would be the minimum wage debate. That is one way of "putting more money in the hands of the poor". But is it really effective when you artificially raise the cost of labor? For supply side vs demand side my opinion likely falls somewhere in the middle. What sets me off and why you see me me rail against "trickle up" is when taxing these people and giving to those people is used as a political tool. It pits people against people rather than presenting a plan that is best for the economy as a whole, not what is better for certain segments of people. A strong economy should benefit all. When the approach is to divide people and then make claims that I'll take from them and give to you the debate has then been reduced to identity politics which I hate. I'm likely not nearly as extreme as you probably consider me to be.


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 11:38 am 
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Quote:
2) Or, we cut taxes for the rich. They are supposed to then hire more people, but do they? Why would they hire more people if the demand for their business has not increased? Seems all too often the extra money the rich get from tax cuts ends up in tax-free Caymen Island accounts where it does noone any good.


I don't think I've ever come on here and defended tax cuts for the rich. What I have done is argued against further tax increases. 50% of people in this country pay no income tax. The top 20% of earners already pay 80% of all taxes. At least those are the numbers floated around. At some point taxing more simply doesn't work. Look at the exodus of rich that is taking place in France. There is a breaking point. Also, a lot of times, $250k is a magical number where to some you are now "rich" and can "afford" to pay more. While that might be the case in some parts of the country, in others it's not. Also, for me at least, its not the tax increase to help the poor that gets under my skin. I'm not heartless and don't like to see people living in poverty. What gets under my skin is the out of control and reckless gov spending (both sides guilty) all the while THEY cry poor and say we need to raise taxes to pay for all this stuff. Ummmm, how about CUTTING some spending too rather than immediately staying the people need to pay more.

Social Security is an example. It's a mess. They say it is going to run out etc etc.

Well, why then are we allowing people who have never paid in to receive benefits? That is wrong to me. Social Security isn't an entitlement program like food stamps or other welfare there to keep people from extreme poverty. People pay into social security. They are supposed to get something back. The amounts they get are reduced because we have added so many and continue to do so.

I'm 46 and have already paid about $200,000 into SS. By the time I'm retired that number will be at least double that. Yet I'm told I'm might not get it or will get a big reduction all the while someone who has paid zero gets some??

Try showing up in another country as a non-citizen and ask where you go pick up your retirement check...


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 11:49 am 
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Posts: 506
Nick79 wrote:
franco32 wrote:
NY State spends the most amount of money per student in the country. These are the results:

http://videos.news12.com/NYSFailingSchoolsReport.pdf

Here in Long Island we have a school district, Hempstead (97% Black and Hispanic..primarily low income), that spends 26,000 per year per student (more than nearby towns with million dollar homes). 26k! They are a failing district. Money isn't going to fix things. It's the family unit that has broken down.


That's because the parents are fucked up and don't participate. And it's not even racial, it's socioeconomic. My daughter is going to a private school now, lots and lots of black kids there, all achieving academically. I've actually heard some of their parents ACTUALLY SAY, that they don't want to send their kids to a black school because there's no learning ethic. And even in schools that are at least half white, there is a trend toward the same thing and no teacher control because political correctness keeps teachers from being allowed to dispense serious discipline, like they do at the private schools. I was always a public school guy, but I just reached a breaking point, learning shit wasn't a priority at her public school, and they simply let fucked up stoners and assholes run wild, especially of certain races to avoid being labeled racist, political correctness keeping them from receiving the ugly, brutal beat downs they deserved.


Holy shit Nick! I thought that you liked Catonsville High? Did you end up sending her to a Catholic school or other private. If it is the Catholic one near you I may see you at a game some time.


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 11:56 am 
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Quote:
3) Hillary's quote was "You know, to just be grossly generalistic, you could put half of Trump's supporters into what I call the basket of deplorables. Right? The racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic, Islamaphobic -- you name it." Hillary didn't call ALL Trump voters deplorable, although I can see that they like to pretend she did so they can wear it like a badge of honor. Tee hee! Hillary called me a deplorable! If you're a racist and you voted for Trump for racist reasons, sure, she called you a deplorable. Wear it with pride! If not, then she wasn't talking about you.


On, so she "only" said half. First off, that "half" is a grossly inflated number. Sure there are ignorant racist and homophobes etc out there. But that exist on the other side too.

It's back to identity politics. That is literally all that woman ran on. That was her platform. She has such a sense of entitlement and really believed the office was her right that she ran a terrible campaign. The left just refuses to see that. She had no platform. None other than:

It's my turn
Because I'm a woman
Because I'm not Donald Trump.

She had no plan for the economy. She had no plan for foreign affairs. She has also had her hand in many of the issues that are taking place around the world today.

There is also the real issue of DNC collusion against Sanders. Where is the outrage there? That guy beat her in how many of those primaries down the stretch yet because of the DNC practice of using the Suoer delegate she was anointed. In a fair primary Sanders is quite possibly the candidate.

Nobody expected Trump. Until he went out and won all those primaries. Sanders didn't have a chance.

People were simply tired of the Clintons and their very long and real trail of corruption and pay to play politics.

The ties to her time as SOS and the massive amounts of money flowing into their "foundation" are real.

Fake news though right?

I will give you a win on every left vs right debate point but my feelings on Hillary cannot be swayed. She is as crooked and corrupt as they come. Only in politics to enrich herself and those around her. Yet she's a "champion for the poor". Biggest sham going.

And my hate for her doesn't mean I love Trump. I don't. However, I can recognize he has already done some good things that have had an impact as well as said and done some stupid shit.

I really do try to look at both sides of things before forming an opinion.

In terms of Hillary though, there are none so blind than those who refuse to see...


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