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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 12:11 pm 
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Nick79 wrote:
franco32 wrote:
NY State spends the most amount of money per student in the country. These are the results:

http://videos.news12.com/NYSFailingSchoolsReport.pdf

Here in Long Island we have a school district, Hempstead (97% Black and Hispanic..primarily low income), that spends 26,000 per year per student (more than nearby towns with million dollar homes). 26k! They are a failing district. Money isn't going to fix things. It's the family unit that has broken down.


That's because the parents are fucked up and don't participate. And it's not even racial, it's socioeconomic. My daughter is going to a private school now, lots and lots of black kids there, all achieving academically. I've actually heard some of their parents ACTUALLY SAY, that they don't want to send their kids to a black school because there's no learning ethic. And even in schools that are at least half white, there is a trend toward the same thing and no teacher control because political correctness keeps teachers from being allowed to dispense serious discipline, like they do at the private schools. I was always a public school guy, but I just reached a breaking point, learning shit wasn't a priority at her public school, and they simply let fucked up stoners and assholes run wild, especially of certain races to avoid being labeled racist, political correctness keeping them from receiving the ugly, brutal beat downs they deserved.



Great post..
Bottom line 26K a kid or 100k a kid it doesn't matter. If the kid doesn't want to learn and would rather be a thug or dumbass, Head etc.. You are not going to reach that kid and he will fail.. Money can not fix stupid..
As soon as our society stops the bleeding heart shit the sooner we will learn that you cant save everyone.. You save who you can and let the others go...
The loser will end up in jail or dead.. No big deal.. But we have to stop supporting them cradle to grave when they themselves don't give a shit..
Nothing makes a person want to work more than an empty belly..
We don't feed bears at state parks because they get used to the free meal.. why the fuck are we doing it for people..
Sorry if it sounds harsh but...
Maybe we should stop all EBT payments and give that money to church groups and food lines where they can then feed the poor.. Just like in the old days..
Stand in a soup line 7 days a week and it will motivate you to get out and get a job.. Get your card filled each month by uncle sugar does nothing except make the lazy even lazier


Ok back to football.. Go Penn State...


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 12:13 pm 
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Quote:
4) I say there was no appreciable voter fraud in the last election so that Hillary's vote total does indeed approach 3 million more votes than Trump. I also say the burden of proof is on you. If you (and Trump) think Hillary's popular vote count should be significantly less but for illegals voting, prove it.


It can't be proven because we have states with no voter ID laws. You saying there was no appreciable voter fraud simply just fits your side of the debate.

And while you can say the same of me, common sense says otherwise.

Riddle me this, why would politicians fight so hard against voter ID laws? Do you really believe it's because they believe they are discrimatory? If so, how?

Even the poor need an ID. There are programs everywhere that will get an ID in your hands even if you are poorest of poor.

So with no voter ID laws in some states who are they helping at the expense of knowing for certain an election was above board?

It is a fantasy to believe non-citizens are not voting in places like CA. It happens. You and I both know I cannot "prove it". But neither can you prove it isn't happening.

Here is another question, why in the world would anyone (left or right) actually want somebody having a say in their life that cannot even obtain legal identification? And they should have a say in how others people money is spent?

Voter ID isn't about discrimination unless you drink the Kool-Aid.

Let's assume for a moment that some of the people in Mexico were not trying to get into this country for our social welfare. Let's pretend they were hardcore racist hillbillies and THEY were the ones coming across the border in mass. You think CA would still be ok with no voter ID laws? Would they still say it's discrimination to ask for ID to cast a vote?

Extreme example I know. But those who fight against voter ID laws are only doing it because they know it allows some number of illegals to vote. What else could possibly be the reason.

Can't obtain an ID. Come on now.... :roll:

And not rolling my eyes at you Poltargyst.

Voting in an election is a RIGHT afforded to CITIZENS under the Constitution, The left has used identity politics once again to make something about race or economic status rather than what it should be.


Last edited by 955876 on Fri Sep 29, 2017 12:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 12:18 pm 
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Poltargyst wrote:
At one point it occurred to me that it seems like the same posters who come down hard on Tomlin are also posters who are coming out as conservatives in political discussions. What do you guys think? Are conservatives also more likely to want to fire Tomlin? Are liberals more likely to be tolerant of his mistakes?

In no way, shape or form am I talking about his race. I'm talking strictly about the personality traits of the posters. Are liberal posters more forgiving that conservatives?


Meh

I loved the Tomlin hire and was a supporter up till recently. Have simply changed my mind based on "what he puts on tape"....

I wasn't raised left or right.

If I had to really describe my views I'd say I'm an economic or fiscal conservative while being socially moderate.


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 12:26 pm 
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Nick79 wrote:
dropemjaybird wrote:
Nick79 wrote:

But you obviously believe in that trickle down NONSENSE and I think that's just a scam for the rich to hoard even more of the pie.


Part owner of a small business - the 20% corp rate would most likely allow us to hire another person or give 3 of our young guys a raise.

You don't know what you are talking about.


Why isn't Kansas thriving in that trickle down paradise they created?
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions ... c733b007a6


This exercise can be played all day though Nick. One could ask why CA isn't thriving in what is the largest "trickle up" welfare state in the nation.

A state with three major sea ports, lots of natural resources, vast wealth, and intellectual capital.

California has many many natural economic advantages and yet the state is in debt beyond repair.

If trickle up worked as well as some think then why is the largest welfare state in the nation also the most in debt in the nation?

A state that also has the highest state income tax in the nation along with a huge ass population paying those taxes.

Things that make you go hmmmm....


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 2:02 pm 
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Quote:
And with a better educated populace, one that can think CRITICALLY, you would have less instances of people voting against their best interests and then have a better chance of electing people who really want to help their voters instead of themselves


I agree with this. However, I suspect (and could be wrong) that the implication here is that Hillary is someone who is really out to help the voters.

One candidate was wealthy outside of politics and one candidate was wealthy because of politics. Some then criticize the source if his wealth while not giving a second thought to hers.

She doesn't run for office to help people. That's a sham. She runs for office to further fund their family business which has long been pay to play politics.

President, Senator, Secretary of State are all great paying jobs. The pay in no way allows one to amas the vast amounts of wealth the Clinton's have. She was a corrupt horrible candidate.

That is not an endorsement of him.

Had the left ran a legitimate (and honest) primary there is a strong chance a candidate would have emerged on their side that might have smoked Trump. Instead they chose to anoint her while colluding against Sanders and not even having anyone else step up to the plate. The entire party handed her the nomination thinking voters would look past all her numerous warts.

They didn't.

For the education stats you posted there (like always) are numerous other factors at play. For starters, look at the huge population disparity. Next, factor how much we (U.S.) spends on social welfare vs education.

If we spent more on education we might be higher on the list. If we spent more on education we might not need as much social welfare.

I support more money to education. And better education at that. We've dumbed things down with "no child left behind" as that leads to no child getting ahead.

Obvious we need programs for the kids that are behind as well as those ready for more.

Tough issues.

Not trying to be argumentative either. I enjoy the debate


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 2:49 pm 
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The fact is we have AT LEAST 11 million illegals living in the US. Many experts feel it is way more than that. But, what people forget is that there are at least another 12 million legal immigrants in the US who are non-citizens. So, we have a population base of at least 23 million people in this country who could fraudulently vote. If even a small fraction of them did, that is catastrophic for an election. Why risk it?

IDs aren't exactly hard to get. In fact, in California, they issue drivers licenses to illegals all the time. So, if even illegals can easily get drivers licenses and many of them don't even speak the language, what is really going on here? As 955876 said, it's all about politics....getting as many votes as you can even from non-citizen sources.

I cringe when I hear people say that blacks are discriminated against because of Voter ID laws. How insulting is that?

If you want a good laugh, watch this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrBxZGWCdgs


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 6:42 pm 
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955876 wrote:
Quote:
2) Or, we cut taxes for the rich. They are supposed to then hire more people, but do they? Why would they hire more people if the demand for their business has not increased? Seems all too often the extra money the rich get from tax cuts ends up in tax-free Caymen Island accounts where it does noone any good.


I don't think I've ever come on here and defended tax cuts for the rich. What I have done is argued against further tax increases. 50% of people in this country pay no income tax. The top 20% of earners already pay 80% of all taxes. At least those are the numbers floated around. At some point taxing more simply doesn't work. Look at the exodus of rich that is taking place in France. There is a breaking point. Also, a lot of times, $250k is a magical number where to some you are now "rich" and can "afford" to pay more. While that might be the case in some parts of the country, in others it's not. Also, for me at least, its not the tax increase to help the poor that gets under my skin. I'm not heartless and don't like to see people living in poverty. What gets under my skin is the out of control and reckless gov spending (both sides guilty) all the while THEY cry poor and say we need to raise taxes to pay for all this stuff. Ummmm, how about CUTTING some spending too rather than immediately staying the people need to pay more.

Social Security is an example. It's a mess. They say it is going to run out etc etc.

Well, why then are we allowing people who have never paid in to receive benefits? That is wrong to me. Social Security isn't an entitlement program like food stamps or other welfare there to keep people from extreme poverty. People pay into social security. They are supposed to get something back. The amounts they get are reduced because we have added so many and continue to do so.

I'm 46 and have already paid about $200,000 into SS. By the time I'm retired that number will be at least double that. Yet I'm told I'm might not get it or will get a big reduction all the while someone who has paid zero gets some??

Try showing up in another country as a non-citizen and ask where you go pick up your retirement check...

I'm reading that SS has problems, but not as big as Republicans would have us believe. They hate government. They hate that SS is in the hands of government when it could be privatized and they could be making money off of it. I'm reading that raising the payroll tax cap could keep SS solvent without needing to raise retirement age or cut benefits.


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 6:53 pm 
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955876 wrote:
Quote:
3) Hillary's quote was "You know, to just be grossly generalistic, you could put half of Trump's supporters into what I call the basket of deplorables. Right? The racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic, Islamaphobic -- you name it." Hillary didn't call ALL Trump voters deplorable, although I can see that they like to pretend she did so they can wear it like a badge of honor. Tee hee! Hillary called me a deplorable! If you're a racist and you voted for Trump for racist reasons, sure, she called you a deplorable. Wear it with pride! If not, then she wasn't talking about you.


On, so she "only" said half. First off, that "half" is a grossly inflated number. Sure there are ignorant racist and homophobes etc out there. But that exist on the other side too.

It's back to identity politics. That is literally all that woman ran on. That was her platform. She has such a sense of entitlement and really believed the office was her right that she ran a terrible campaign. The left just refuses to see that. She had no platform. None other than:

It's my turn
Because I'm a woman
Because I'm not Donald Trump.

She had no plan for the economy. She had no plan for foreign affairs. She has also had her hand in many of the issues that are taking place around the world today.

There is also the real issue of DNC collusion against Sanders. Where is the outrage there? That guy beat her in how many of those primaries down the stretch yet because of the DNC practice of using the Suoer delegate she was anointed. In a fair primary Sanders is quite possibly the candidate.

Nobody expected Trump. Until he went out and won all those primaries. Sanders didn't have a chance.

People were simply tired of the Clintons and their very long and real trail of corruption and pay to play politics.

The ties to her time as SOS and the massive amounts of money flowing into their "foundation" are real.

Fake news though right?

I will give you a win on every left vs right debate point but my feelings on Hillary cannot be swayed. She is as crooked and corrupt as they come. Only in politics to enrich herself and those around her. Yet she's a "champion for the poor". Biggest sham going.

And my hate for her doesn't mean I love Trump. I don't. However, I can recognize he has already done some good things that have had an impact as well as said and done some stupid shit.

I really do try to look at both sides of things before forming an opinion.

In terms of Hillary though, there are none so blind than those who refuse to see...

We'll agree to disagree about Hillary. Maybe she needed to articulate her ideas better, but Republicans are supply-siders, Democrats are demand-siders. There is little doubt that Hillary is a demand-sider and would have implemented such policies.

I read once that some former president--one of the Bushes maybe?--was getting paid $100k per speech. I'm sure Bill and Hillary could command that kind of pay too. If each of them travel around the country giving speeches at $100k a pop, that would eventually add up to some real money. They do consulting, and I'm sure they charge well for that. They've written books. There are legitimate ways for people of their celebrity to acquire wealth without it having to be nefarious.

And we talked about the Clinton Foundation before, and I said that Charity Watch graded the Clinton Foundation with an A+ rating and reported that 90% of donations go to charity.

Somehow wanting to make money doesn't get held against Republicans.


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 7:06 pm 
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955876 wrote:
Quote:
4) I say there was no appreciable voter fraud in the last election so that Hillary's vote total does indeed approach 3 million more votes than Trump. I also say the burden of proof is on you. If you (and Trump) think Hillary's popular vote count should be significantly less but for illegals voting, prove it.


It can't be proven because we have states with no voter ID laws. You saying there was no appreciable voter fraud simply just fits your side of the debate.

And while you can say the same of me, common sense says otherwise.

Riddle me this, why would politicians fight so hard against voter ID laws? Do you really believe it's because they believe they are discrimatory? If so, how?

Even the poor need an ID. There are programs everywhere that will get an ID in your hands even if you are poorest of poor.

So with no voter ID laws in some states who are they helping at the expense of knowing for certain an election was above board?

It is a fantasy to believe non-citizens are not voting in places like CA. It happens. You and I both know I cannot "prove it". But neither can you prove it isn't happening.

Here is another question, why in the world would anyone (left or right) actually want somebody having a say in their life that cannot even obtain legal identification? And they should have a say in how others people money is spent?

Voter ID isn't about discrimination unless you drink the Kool-Aid.

Let's assume for a moment that some of the people in Mexico were not trying to get into this country for our social welfare. Let's pretend they were hardcore racist hillbillies and THEY were the ones coming across the border in mass. You think CA would still be ok with no voter ID laws? Would they still say it's discrimination to ask for ID to cast a vote?

Extreme example I know. But those who fight against voter ID laws are only doing it because they know it allows some number of illegals to vote. What else could possibly be the reason.

Can't obtain an ID. Come on now.... :roll:

And not rolling my eyes at you Poltargyst.

Voting in an election is a RIGHT afforded to CITIZENS under the Constitution, The left has used identity politics once again to make something about race or economic status rather than what it should be.

It is a simple fact that the more people vote in an election, the more likely it is for Democrats to win. The fewer people vote in an election, the more likely it is for Republicans to win. Democrats are therefore motivated to get as many people to vote as possible. I'm not talking about committing voter fraud, but legitimately getting as many people as possible registered and to the polls as possible. Sorry, but if you can't cite examples of voter fraud occurring--especially to the levels you and Trump have talked about--then I don't have a reason to believe it. No one wants people who aren't citizens voting, but anyone who is a citizen should definitely be voting.

So Republicans are motivated to discourage voting as much as possible. The concern here is that there are states across the land with Republican governments imposing rules to make it harder to vote not because of any actual concern about voter fraud, but just to make it harder for people--especially people likely to vote Democrat--to vote. And of course they claim it's necessary because of all the voter fraud don't you know, but again in the absence of actual examples of voter fraud, it just looks like voter suppression to win elections.

It sounds reasonable that people should just be able to get some form of ID, but I don't know everyone's situation. Maybe it is difficult for someone who is a citizen but can't speak English or drive or perhaps is disabled. The concern is that any time a new requirement to vote is added, some legitimate citizens will be prevented from voting, always to the benefit of Republicans.


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 Post subject: Re: GET OUT OF MY SPORTS!!!!
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 7:45 pm 
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There is a solid track record of what former Presidents earn on the speach circuit. It declines the longer they have been out of office.

Clintons were declining too. Until Hillary became SOS. Then they skyrocket to the highest in history. The pay to play accusations are real whether you can admit it or not.

The voter ID stuff is ridiculous on so many levels. Can't get an ID for whatever reason but can get to the voting booth.

If the left didn't know illegals were getting to vote they wouldn't fight so hard against voter ID.

Did you watch the video Franco posted?

People have ID. Yes even poor people. How do they ever get benefits if they dont have ID? They just show up and say my name is Joe Blow, please send my check to this address made payable to Joe Blow? It's a sham? It also shows how staunchly you will defend your side no matter what lengths you must go to. This stuff happens. The most basic of common sense says so. You have lots of illegals (especially here in CA) thy know heir says here and money recieved could be numbered if Trump got elected. And you think hey aren't going to vote? That doesn't even pass the smell test.

And again, do you really want someone have a say in the lives of others that can't even manage to get basic ID? I don't want them even salting my fires.

I think I've shown to at least try to be flexible and open minded in this debate. I get the sense you'd defend anything left no matter how preposterous.

Yes. The more people that vote the more democrats win. Gee, I wonder why?

I guess what it really shows is depite winning big in NY & CA she lost REALLY bad elsewhere.

Oh wait, misogyny, racism, homophobes, Russians, islamaphobes populate those stars. I forgot.

You win here. I was wrong. Hillary's loooong history or corruption really has just been a vast right wing conspiracy all along. All of it.

I'm just thankful she escaped all that Bosnian sniper fire so she was around long enough to get her ass kicked in the election.


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